SLC disks / brakes

[Craig Gillingham]

safety:

My SLC "turnkey" car was delivered with wilwood KV-120-5960-RS and EV-120-5961-RS part number brakes on the standard rotors.

All SLC kit builders please check that the rear calipers that you have been supplied with are not as per mine as they are dangerous as the std pads will fall out within a few hundred miles in this configuration.


regards

 

[Alex]

Well, stopping is over-rated anyways :laugh:

BTW, my rotors arn't Wilwoods; maybe it was changed along the way?

 

[Alex]

Btw, I remember reading ???Mr. Pinks??? explanation on PH and I could have sworn he felt it was the rotors not beign thick enough, not a caliper issue?

Then again, there really wasn't any scientific/mathematical analysis behind the conclusion, so.......

 

[Howard Jones]

Craig, it would be nice if you posted some pictures and a little more detail of the problem. I was looking at mine and I can't see how the pads could fall out. ws the bridge bolt missing?

 

[Alex]

Craig, it would be nice if you posted some pictures and a little more detail of the problem. I was looking at mine and I can't see how the pads could fall out. ws the bridge bolt missing?

On PH, IIRC, ???Mr Pink??? said that if the pads wore 25% they would simply fall out of the caliper. Like yourself, I don't see how that could possibly be - the bridge bolt holds them, and as they wear the pistons should push them inwards....... (there's my non-scientific explanation, heh)

 

[GARY_S]

As I happen to be the aforementioned ???Mr Pink??? I assume this is an invitation to offer an explanation to this problem.

Sorry to say I am unable to do so on the grounds that previous postings I have made where I have attempted to profer explanations of events or issues have been met with instant deletion.

So unless Craig wishes to explain further you will just have to make your own minds up

 

[Jac Mac]

Gary S, if this is really the case then post the info ( preferably with pics to clarify it ) on the chassis/brake section of the Tech Forums rather than here where there is obviously in conflict with RCR & forum rules, resist the temptation to make a song & dance about it & simply post solid info, this way it will be of use to those that might have similar issues.

 

[Dave]

I think as usual, he will just post the once to inflame certain people and be done with it whether is is true or not. No explanation, proof or anything to support his claim.

In any case, I got the Brembo's so I'm not worried

 

[Alex]

In any case, I got the Brembo's so I'm not worried

Sounds like a Brembo-people conspiracy to me :worried:

 

[Doc Kaler]

This appears to be a fault of Wilwood rather then RCR in any event if true. Clearly, Caig is merely pointing to what he feels might be a safety issue with Wilwood. Although I have the Brembos, it's just worth it to check out your Wilwoods. Wilwood has been manufacturing SAFE brake systems for decades and cannot control proper installation of their brakes by others. But humans err.

 

[Howard Jones]

Gary, If you don't intend to help then don't do anything at all. Posting a "safety" notice and not providing the full information to help people correct a safety issue isn't welcome on this forum, at least by me. What you have done is worry those of us who might be learning and pissed off the rest of us who are trying learn something and help fellow hobbyists.

Brake pads don't just fall out if the thing was put together correctly in the first place. I have had SL Wilwoods on my GTD for years, done 100s of miles on track, and have had to replace pads due to wear. I could have run them all the way to the backing plate and they would not have "fallen out".

Post full info or don't post at all. You haven't helped anybody with this bull shit. Sorry if I offended anybody else.

 

[Alex]

Gary, If you don't intend to help then don't do anything at all. Posting a "safety" notice and not providing the full information to help people correct a safety issue isn't welcome on this forum, at least by me. What you have done is worry those of us who might be learning and pissed off the rest of us who are trying learn something and help fellow hobbyists.

Brake pads don't just fall out if the thing was put together correctly in the first place. I have had SL Wilwoods on my GTD for years, done 100s of miles on track, and have had to replace pads due to wear. I could have run them all the way to the backing plate and they would not have "fallen out".

Post full info or don't post at all. You haven't helped anybody with this bull shit. Sorry if I offended anybody else.

I agree.

 

[Craig Gillingham]

wooo woo woo saftey shouldnt be an area of argument...... and as for alex comment "stopping is over-rated" well it maybe for you but for the child at a bus stop will rely on it.
For clarification - the willwood calipers as indicated in part numbers above were on a "standard" SLC 20mm wide rear brake disks...as supplied by RCR.
This caliper is for a wider disk and in this configuration after 20% wear the pad will be outside its mounts and 100% sure to go.

so in simple terms check your caliper part numbers as above and if its on a 20mm rear wide disk then you shouldnt assemble as it is dangerous as verified by UK IVA in May 2009.
If you havnt got my initial set up on the rear then you can sleep easy....if you have then the calipers or disks need changing..

 

[GARY_S]

Post full info or don't post at all. You haven't helped anybody with this bull shit. Sorry if I offended anybody else.

I must be going senile as I don't remember posting anything about brakes or safety on here!!

 

[Arnie Webb]

Right, here are some unbiased facts:

I purchased the calipers from Craigs SLC to use on my own Foreman P4 replica. Other than this I have no relationship commercial or otherwise to Craig or the Aspira.

The calipers inn question are the Wilwood Superlite Billet 6 pots, and these are designed for a 31.8mm width disc (rotor). They are available in different widths (and differnt part numbers) for use with narrower rotors.

I saw all the parts RCR delivered to Craig as a rolling chassis, and the car has (much inferior 1 piece) 20.6mm discs on the rear and 25.4mm discs on the front.

RCR use 31.8mm discs on a number of the other kit cars they produce, hence why this component was likely chosen.

These combinations of parts mean the pistons can push the pads such that the pad backing plate does not fully engage with the guides, leaving it free to move around beyond the Wilwood designed confines.

3.8mm of pad wear will disengage the pad from its guides within the caliper, such as the pad is not seated correctly in the caliper. This has nothing to do with the bridge bar.

This is not a Wilwood design issue, it is a construction and use issue. The combination of parts is exactly why Wilwood have their disclaimer of liability printed on almost every page fo their technical documentation!

Craig is correct in warning you of this issue. This should be the subject of a notification from RCR to every person to whom they have supplied these parts.

It's not a subjective debate on bad engineering practice, its a critical safety issue with the RCR Superlite.

 

[Jack]

Some helpful info, Mine match perfectly!

SL6 WITH STAINLESS STEEL PISTONS:​

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(1)​

FRONT MOUNT PART NO. REAR MOUNT PART NO.​

BORE SIZE DISC WIDTH RH LH RH LH​

1.62/1.12/1.12” - 41,1/28,4/28,4 mm 1.25” 31,8 mm 120-5960-FS 120-5961-FS 120-5960-RS 120-5961-RS
1.62/1.12/1.12” - 41,1/28,4/28,4 mm 1.00” 25,4 mm 120-5958-FS 120-5959-FS 120-5958-RS 120-5959-RS​

1.62/1.12/1.12” - 41,1/28,4/28,4 mm .81” 20,6 mm 120-5956-FS 120-5957-FS 120-5956-RS 120-5957-RS

 

[Craig Gillingham]

Craig, it would be nice if you posted some pictures and a little more detail of the problem. I was looking at mine and I can't see how the pads could fall out. ws the bridge bolt missing?

hi howard,
what size width disks front and rear have you been supplied with and what part numbers do you have on the calipers?
regards

 

[Howard Jones]

Fair enough. I'll take a tire off and have a look, write down some part numbers, make some measurements, and check with Wilwood's webpage.

 

[Alex]

hi howard,
what size width disks front and rear have you been supplied with and what part numbers do you have on the calipers?
regards

Mine's disassembled so I'll go look - how is the width of the rotors measured usually (i.e., end to end - outside diameter?)?

 

[Jack]

Thickness Alex..

 

[Dave Lindemann]

I went out and checked my SLC and here are the Wilwood numbers: 120-5956-RS and 120-5957-RS which according to Wilwood are the correct calipers for that rotor (.81" or 20.6 mm).

Regards,
Dave L