welding input shaft

[Mike]

As I mate a UN1 to an engine and bellhousing, the input shaft is 2"s too short. Several machinist suggested making a new shaft which is expensive and one said that if I went to a properly equipped axle shop, they could weld a different clutch spline end on and heat treat it. This could make it longer and also solve the matching problem of the clutch spline to the engine.
My experience here is limited. Any feedback from those of you that might have done this?
Thanks
Mike

 

[Kevin Box]

Gt40 NZ had new input shafts made up for the SBF to Renault combination

I will see if i can find out who made them ???


regards

Kevin B

:idea:

 

[Leon]

Hi Mike, I had an adapter shaft made for an off road truck a few years ago, it was a TH400 yoke with a splined shaft welded it the other end to match the transferr box. This truck was running 600hp and pushing a 2ton truck in extreme off road comps and I ran it for 4 seasons and then sold the truck and he has now run it for another 4 years. If done right it does work fine. I don't think it had any heat treatment after welding but it was Lo Hydrogen Tig welded by an expert. I also worked in a Rod shop in th early 80s and we used to Shorten 9" axles by cutting them off infront of the wheel bearing surface, bore the flange, turn the axlse shaft down and heat shrink the flange back on to the shaft, we turnd the end of the shaft to a 45 degree tapper and then Lo Hydro welded the end of the shaft to the flange. They put them in drag cars and I never heard of one breaking at the weld.
Cheers Leonmac

 

[Keith]

As a matter of interest I looked up Derek Bell Performance Designs because I know he made a strengthened (and I thought longer) input shaft for the UN1 which end up in Lotus Elise's and some '40's. However, it appears his link is dead and he seems to have vanished. I wonder if that was to do with Mark Sibley's MDA demise as they were producing the T70 together?

Answers on a different (new) thread of course please.

 

[Frank Catt]

We tried electron beam welding an extension to a Renault shaft once many years ago, useing a welding company doing similar welding on aero engine blades and for F1 teams. The weld was a failure not because of the welding technique or the new metal in the extension, but because of the very poor quality of the original shaft metal. Good experiment tought us a lot, but still a failure. Frank

 

[Leon]

That is some thing to be aware of, Quite often we build and modify stuff and don't take into consideration the quality of what we are sticking it to, as Frank said the part that was welded was better quality than the orignal shaft but at the end of the day, end result is failure. Leonmac

 

[Paul W]

There are adaptor shafts readily made up for the Un1 but depends on what engine you need it for.

 

[Paul Thompson 'Hooligan']

As a matter of interest I looked up Derek Bell Performance Designs because I know he made a strengthened (and I thought longer) input shaft for the UN1 which end up in Lotus Elise's and some '40's. However, it appears his link is dead and he seems to have vanished. I wonder if that was to do with Mark Sibley's MDA demise as they were producing the T70 together?

Answers on a different (new) thread of course please.

Still available I think - or something very similar through Kevin Jones of GTO Engineering, who also does a 6-Speed straight cut close ratio conversion for the UN1 with uprated capability...

 

[Mike]

Thanks for all your input. I'll check with Kevin as well as a few machine shops.
Mike

 

[Kevin Box]

Mike

Sorry no luck with tracking down supplier.

I suspect any gearcutting shop could help.
If you like I will messure mine and post picture with dimensions


regards

KevinB:huh:

 

[Roark_John]

It can be done. I happen to know for a fact that Mendeola does it with the pinion shaft on one of their models...

Just gotta know what material the original is made from and match it. 4160 or 4165 is usually the stock material, at least with most OEM US boxes.

 

[Cliff Beer]

A skilled MIG welder, with proper jigging can do that for you. If it's not dead center though, you'll feel some vibration and the input shaft seal will quickly start to leak. Best to know the precise metallurgy of the shaft being welded so that the weld rod and amperage can be tailored to suit.

There's a machine shop in Seattle here that does friction welding, mostly for truck axles and such. The theory is that it's a much stronger weld than the typical perimeter MIG weld with only partial penetration, as the friction weld is made across the entire face. And, with friction welding it's virtually a complete certainty that the (now welded) part is perfectly centered/aligned. Might be a really good way to get done what you're looking to do in a very durable manner. Just an idea.

 

[Danny]

Try:

Ampa Engineering Co Pty Ltd
Unit 1, 24 Stanley St, Peakhurst NSW 2210, Australia
(02) 9533 5551

They recently made an input shaft extension (with internal and external splines) for a mate's Audi box as well as the axles for him. It wasn't too expensive about AUD$350 for the input shaft which may be in the range of a welded one.