A very powerful piece of writing by Bryan Forbes

David Morton

Lifetime Supporter
Getting off the pot while we have the chance would be / is my choice. Then call in our air superiority and glass the place over once and for all. Alternately if Karzai has any feelings for his country then stand in the corner and shut up while another election is run, though the approaching winter will make sure it will never happen. If that doesn't / can't happen then Abdullah Abdullah should be instated pro tem and Karzai told in no uncertain terms his time is over. Got it? Bang.......
Until then, no more of anything and start the phased exit strategy. Do we have an exit strategy yet ? I don't think Brown and Obamah have got that far yet , apart from some General saying they are there for the next forty years. If that is true this war will still be going on when I get reincarnated.......
Now - what would I like to come back as................?

Please write to your respective political 'leaders'. If nothing else it makes you feel better and as though one day,you might just have a voice.
 
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Keith

Moderator
I'm Totally Perplexed.

Taliban extract "tax" from poppy farmers which funds provides arms/logistics. Farmers export raw opium via donkeys. In Afghanistan. Within plane (:blank:) sight.

USA has more weapons hardware with 100% guaranteed lethality than any other nation on earth.

USA also deploys the most modern and well equipped air force in history.

USA has highly developed drone aircraft controlled from within the US borders that can film , photo, and/or drop bombs and fire missiles.

Britain has token force of 9,000 there who's sole duty is to fight with one arm tied behind their backs.

To wit:
The official investigation of a UK "Special Forces" soldier who threatened to shoot a Taliban suspect during interrogation. (Whatever next, threatening the suspect with an episode of X Factor?)

NOTE TO THE POLITICIANS OF ALL DEMOMINATIONS.

I believe that the Western "democracies" have completely lost the plot trying to appear fair and democratic against a ruthless enemy fighting on his own turf that has never ever been "defeated". You can't defeat a nation with millions of replacements in the wings and not necessarily sourced within it's own borders..

You ALSO can't win this mess by pussy footing around with half assed measures hoping that the "decent" majority will stick flowers in your gun barrels. They didn't in Vietnam, Iraq and they certainly will never do it here as long as there is black powder left on earth.

Telling your fighting men to "take off your helmets to show you're friendly" is about as much use as a chocolate teapot whilst he is carrying an SA80 and a Claymore.

You either do it properly or get the fuck out of it. You are betraying thousands of our military by believing this region could ever become "democratic" so what IS your mission objective exactly?

By the way, the sum total of my education was up to the age of fifteen, but even I learned enough about the "North West Frontier" by that time to know it's hopeless now. If Afghan 'A' by birth happens to be in a tribe that supports the aims of the Taliban, and carries a gun and willingingly uses it to enforce his viewpoint and by contrast Afghan 'B' is born in a peaceful environment but is terrorised by Afghan 'A'. Theoretically they carry the same regional genes so why doesn't Afghan 'B' get himself a gun and kick the shit out of Afghan 'A' himself? (PS please substitute Korean, Vietnamese, Iraqi and it works the same way.) You have to think way way beyond your fridge freezer new car philosphy to get inside these peoples heads.

Glazing the poppy fields to show you REALLY mean business would be a start. An effort to democratise the undemocratic (by birth) means absolutely FA if you leave that white death untouched, or perhaps the CIA are managing the export?

That's quite enough rant for one day. By the way, this is a copy of a Note sent to my Member of Parliament.
 

Ian Anderson

Lifetime Supporter
So now that my MP the very same Mr Wiltshire who syphoned off £100k into his own company has decided he is retiring at next election what good will writing to hom do?

After all - all he is now doing is skimming more cash into his pension fund and collecting another X months of service up to the election date against his pension entitlement. Do you think he will do anything up to the election?

Ian
 
Keith, I agree with your sentiment regarding Afghan A and Afghan B.

For countless decades we have sought to apply western democratic values to other regions of the world with vastly different results. Abject failures include swathes of Africa, and currently Afghanistan.

How about instead of glassing the poppy fields (which I have no problem with), why not try the sanctioning of growth through licencing for use in medical and pharmaceutical fields. Its an old argument, but one i'd be interested in hearing from you guys...

Graham.
 
I believe that the Afgan problem is solvable, but it is going to take a determined will that the Western Nations do not have. It seems that we don't have the stomach for hard choices (Kieth's comments regarding glassing over) and the absolute resolve to finish the job. Our Area Commander has endorsed a solution which is 'politically correct' for our times and he may have the best solution in that context. Our Commander in Chief origionally agreed with him and is now waffling (shades of Vietnam-ask me how I know!)
The Taliban will not go away overnight. This game will take decades to play out. What is not or should not be on the table for discussion is the Allies running away. That will bolster the Taliban and put huge pressure on Pakistan (and ultimately India) Can anyone see the possibility that Pakistan falls to extremist leadership armed with Nuclear Weapons? We cannot let that happen. Our children will pay the price.
Sometimes, a generation must fight the common enemy of peaceful nations at great cost. To not do so will ensure that peace will not endure. Ask any miltary man and he will tell you that is the price he is willing to pay. As for our Pols...not so much.
I for one do not believe that we cannot prevail against this evil foe if we take the gloves off and do the proper job...right now, with no mercy for our enemies. Brutal it will be to the locals caught in the crossfire, but even more brutal to the non-combatants if we walk away. The choices are distasteful, but that is what we reaped from our shortsighted political solutions in the last century. I'll end my rant and let others comment.

Garry
 

Pete McCluskey.

Lifetime Supporter
Just a small sample about the poppy fields I found by using Mr. Google.
90% of the worlds heroin comes from this source, while politicians sit on their hands and talk of "solutions" and "alternative crops". Why wont they learn from History? Nuke the bastards and get the hell-out.

The dilemma of Afghanistan's poppy production has long bedeviled civilian and military strategists. The crop makes up 90% of the world's opium, which is used to make heroin, and a third of the nation's gross domestic product, according to the United Nations. Opium profits fuel the insurgency, but so does destroying the poppy crops of poor farmers, says Lt. Col. John Glaze, whose 2007 report for the Army War College argued against eradication.
Poppy production has skyrocketed since the 2001 U.S. invasion. President Bush proposed chemical spraying to kill poppy fields, but the Afghan government and European countries resisted that step as too harsh. In the past two years, the Bush administration pursued a strategy that combined limited poppy-plant eradication by hand and relatively modest programs to help farmers grow alternative crops.
The military also began targeting opium traffickers, as opposed to growers. Former Afghanistan counternarcotics coordinator Thomas Schweich says that formula succeeded in driving down opium production by 6% last year, and the number of acres under cultivation dropped 19%. Other experts, including Felbab-Brown, attribute that decline to market saturation and drought.
Holbrooke criticized the Bush strategy in a column in TheWashington Post last year. "Even without aerial eradication," he wrote, "the program, which costs around $1 billion a year, may be the single most ineffective program in the history of American foreign policy. It's not just a waste of money. It actually strengthens the Taliban and al-Qaeda."
Holbrooke repeated that view March 22 at a public forum in Brussels.
"We have gotten nothing out of it — nothing," he said. "It is true that some … opium crop has been destroyed, but it hasn't hurt the Taliban one iota. We're often pushing farmers into the Taliban hands."
Felbab-Brown said providing wheat seeds to farmers in exchange for not growing opium won't work.
"Afghan farmers can buy wheat seeds, that's not the problem," she said. "The problem is that they can't make sufficient living on it or get access to credit and land. Wheat is also much less labor-intensive so it won't be able to absorb the same amount of farmers as opium poppy can."
Obama said Friday that officials will monitor the growth of illegal opium production in Afghanistan as one measure of progress in the nation.
In an e-mail to USA TODAY, Holbrooke said the opium strategy was not fully formulated.
"In the time available we could not design an all new program but there was unanimity that there was significant flaws in the current program," he said. "Now that the Strategic Review is done, we will turn our attention towards agriculture sector job creation and alternative livelihoods while at the same time the government has to go after the drug lords."
 

David Morton

Lifetime Supporter
The MPs in the UK are just so thick, they still do not get the fact that a majority of the public are seething with anger about the expenses scandal. Now they want a pay rise. This from the Telegraph:

MPs' expenses: pay rise for MPs to stop rebellion

MPs are to be offered a pay rise to make up for a loss of income from expenses claims under plans drawn up by Gordon Brown to quell a growing back-bench rebellion.



<!-- Make sure there is no whitespoace at the end of the bline -->By Andrew Porter, Political Editor
Published: 10:26PM BST 20 Oct 2009

commons_1472010c.jpg
Many MPs have argued throughout the expenses scandal that MPs need a significant pay rise Photo: EPA


The Prime Minister is desperate to avoid a Commons mutiny over next month’s report by Sir Christopher Kelly, which is expected to sweep away many of the MPs’ allowances.
Under Mr Brown’s plan, any rise in an MP’s basic salary of £64,766 would be paid for by a reduction in ministers’ wages. Currently, 98 MPs serve as members of the Government, earning between £96,000 and £197,000. If they took a £20,000 pay cut, it would save almost £2 million and mean all 646 MPs could be paid around £3,000 more without further cost to the taxpayer.
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The prospect of a pay rise for MPs just months after the expenses scandal would risk uproar. However, Mr Brown is desperate to avoid further criticism from his own MPs after Sir Thomas Legg’s insistence that they pay back thousands of pounds in excessive or incorrect claims.
Some have threatened to ignore his requests to repay public money.
The Prime Minister believes that Sir Christopher’s report will represent a bigger challenge to party leaders than the Legg inquiry as it is likely to recommend a series of measures that will severely curtail the expenses and allowances MPs are allowed to claim.
In particular, it is understood that he will forbid MPs from employing family members, a move that is certain to cause considerable anger among backbenchers.
Mr Brown has already said he will accept Sir Christopher’s findings. With MPs growing increasingly fearful of a stricter regime, he wants to offer them a deal that effectively buys their silence.
“If we show that ministers are being paid less and the overall bill in terms of salary is not going up then it could be done,” a Downing Street source said.
The total ministerial wage bill stands at almost £12.3 million, including the salaries of 18 members of the Lords who serve as ministers. The Prime Minister’s salary is £197,000 and he draws £192,414. Cabinet ministers are entitled to £144,520 a year, but have chosen to draw £140,176. Junior ministers earn £106,000 and ministerial aides £96,000. Members of the Lords who serve as ministers have a starting salary of just over £73,000.
Many MPs, including some who wrote to Sir Christopher, have argued throughout the expenses scandal provoked by The Daily Telegraph’s disclosures, that MPs need a significant pay rise. They have maintained that MPs assumed the expenses and allowances were effectively part of the salary to which they were entitled.
It is doubtful, therefore, that many backbenchers would be content with a modest pay rise. But they are also aware that any suggestions of an increase will be met with considerable public anger.
Mr Brown hopes to persuade voters that the move would make MPs’ pay more transparent and less reliant on “top-up” allowances.
Any increase would have to be agreed by the Senior Salaries Review Body, but Mr Brown believes that if he can get agreement between party leaders the new salary levels could be in place by next year.
The move will be seen as an attempt by Mr Brown to outflank the Conservatives by taking the initiative on expenses reform.
The Prime Minister has been criticised for being slower to respond to the scandal than David Cameron.
Mr Cameron has already indicated that he is willing to cut the cost of government. He has said that, under his premiership, ministers may have to do more work for less money.
The Conservative leader has also hinted that his Cabinet will be smaller than Labour’s and a host of junior roles could be swept aside.
According to Downing Street sources, Mr Brown realised the full extent of MPs’ anger following this week’s meeting of the Parliamentary Labour Party.
Labour MPs are angry that they will be forced to sack wives or husbands, who work for as little as £16,000 a year, in order to comply with the new rules.
Sir Christopher is known to favour the system used by the US House of Representatives which bans family members from working for elected representatives.
MPs are likely to face a wholesale shake-up in the way they can claim for their second homes after widespread abuse of the system was exposed by The Daily Telegraph including the practice of “flipping.”
Sir Christopher Kelly’s report is expected to call for MPs to rent homes in London or their constituency rather than buy a house which can be exploited for personal gain.
Mr Brown will have a particularly difficult job persuading the public that MPs deserve a pay rise following the Treasury announcement earlier this month of a pay freeze among large parts of the public sector.
Last week Mr Brown was assailed by Labour MPs angry that Sir Thomas Legg had made retrospective demands for expenses legitimately claimed to be paid back.
Backbenchers believe Mr Brown blundered by allowing Sir Thomas to make the wholesale requests for repayment and that the Prime Minister, by agreeing to pay back £12,500, was forcing them to abide by the ruling.
 
The trouble is that a number of those MPs caught fiddling their expenses will probably be re-elected at the next election by those constituencies that have brain dead electorates which always elect an MP from the same party, however bad the party or prospective MP.

God help us all - until the revolution that is!

Chris
 

Keith

Moderator
REDFLAG.gif



Brown's Version

The working class can kiss my ass
I got the The Prime Minister's job at last.

You can tell old Blair I'm off the dole -
He can stick his Red Flag up his 'ole!

Then raise the Workers' Bomb on high!
Beneath its shroud we'll gladly die!

Though all our critics do shout, "Balls!"
They'll be beneath it when it falls.


:hanged:
 

David Morton

Lifetime Supporter
The MPs of the Government in the UK had an eighty two (82) day break (recess) for summer. Now the Leader of the House of Commons,Deputy Leader of the Labour Party and Minister for Women, Harriet Harperson has decreed that Christmas
recess will be from December 16th lasting possibly until January 5th 2010.
That will make 111 days in recess in 12 months including the Easter and Half term recesses in 2009. The leader of the house has decreed that this is not time off but time to allow the MPs to return to their individual constituancies and work there as well.
Give me a break...........
 
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Pete McCluskey.

Lifetime Supporter
The MPs of the Government in the UK had an eighty two (82) day break (recess) for summer. Now the Leader of the House of Commons,Deuty Leader of th eLabour Party and Minister for Women, Harriet Harperson has decreed that Christmas
recess will be from December 16th lasting possibly until January 5th 2010.
That will make 111 days in recess in 12 months including the Easter and Half term recesses in 2009. The leader of the house has decreed that this is not time off but time to allow the MPs to return to their individual constituancies and work there as well.
Give me a break...........

Come on Dave, those poor Pollies deserve a break, look at all the stress they have had to endure while that nasty man has been checking their expense claims. Add that to the poor wages they get paid no wonder they need more time off.
Anyway when they are in recess they can't f**k anything up!
 

David Morton

Lifetime Supporter
From The Sunday Times
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October 25, 2009


No 10 ally’s £230,000 expenses bill




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Baroness Goudie, a Labour donor and fundraiser, has lived since childhood in London where her two sons grew up and her husband works as a leading barrister.
However, the baroness tells the Lords her main address is 400 miles away in a Glasgow apartment block. A close neighbour said she had not seen Goudie there for some time.
This has allowed Goudie to claim subsistence allowances intended as payments for peers who are based outside the capital and need help to meet the cost of accommodation in London.
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<!-- END: Module - M63 - Article Related Attachements -->On Friday Goudie acknowledged she did not spend much of her time in the Glasgow flat, although she was there “frequently”. She said she needed a “main residence” in Scotland because it was the base of her non-parliamentary activities.
In the past six months The Sunday Times has identified more than 20 peers whose claims are questionable. This has led to police investigations into Baroness Uddin, Lord Clarke of Hampstead and Lord Taylor of Warwick.
 
David,
I was wondering if you had the expense account for Lord Black. I was wondering what he was billing for his Condo at the Coleman Federal Corrections Suites north of Orlando. I hear there are Vacancies.
Dave
 

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David Morton

Lifetime Supporter
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'ASYLUM'.

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David Morton

Lifetime Supporter
223 British and 897 USA Troops have lost their lives in Afghanistan up to today.



Coalition Military Fatalities By Year

<TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" id=ctl00_ContentPlaceHolder1_GridView1 class=Smalltable border=1 rules=all cellSpacing=0><TBODY><TR class=contactDept><TH scope=col>Year</TH><TH scope=col>US</TH><TH scope=col>UK</TH><TH scope=col>Other</TH><TH scope=col>Total</TH></TR><TR><TD class=contact>2001</TD><TD class=contactNumber>12</TD><TD class=contactNumber>0</TD><TD class=contactNumber>0</TD><TD class=contactNumber>12</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contact>2002</TD><TD class=contactNumber>49</TD><TD class=contactNumber>3</TD><TD class=contactNumber>17</TD><TD class=contactNumber>69</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contact>2003</TD><TD class=contactNumber>48</TD><TD class=contactNumber>0</TD><TD class=contactNumber>9</TD><TD class=contactNumber>57</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contact>2004</TD><TD class=contactNumber>52</TD><TD class=contactNumber>1</TD><TD class=contactNumber>6</TD><TD class=contactNumber>59</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contact>2005</TD><TD class=contactNumber>99</TD><TD class=contactNumber>1</TD><TD class=contactNumber>31</TD><TD class=contactNumber>131</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contact>2006</TD><TD class=contactNumber>98</TD><TD class=contactNumber>39</TD><TD class=contactNumber>54</TD><TD class=contactNumber>191</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contact>2007</TD><TD class=contactNumber>117</TD><TD class=contactNumber>42</TD><TD class=contactNumber>73</TD><TD class=contactNumber>232</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contact>2008</TD><TD class=contactNumber>155</TD><TD class=contactNumber>51</TD><TD class=contactNumber>88</TD><TD class=contactNumber>294</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contact>2009</TD><TD class=contactNumber>267</TD><TD class=contactNumber>86</TD><TD class=contactNumber>83</TD><TD class=contactNumber>436</TD></TR><TR class=contactDept><TD>Total</TD><TD align=right>897</TD><TD align=right>223</TD><TD align=right>361</TD><TD>1481</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

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<MAP id=imctl00_ContentPlaceHolder1_RadChart1 name=imctl00_ContentPlaceHolder1_RadChart1> <AREA title="2001: 12" shape=rect alt="" coords=27,132,38,134><AREA title="2002: 69" shape=rect alt="" coords=45,118,56,134><AREA title="2003: 57" shape=rect alt="" coords=64,121,75,134><AREA title="2004: 59" shape=rect alt="" coords=82,120,93,134><AREA title="2005: 131" shape=rect alt="" coords=100,103,111,134><AREA title="2006: 191" shape=rect alt="" coords=119,89,130,134><AREA title="2007: 232" shape=rect alt="" coords=137,79,148,134><AREA title="2008: 294" shape=rect alt="" coords=155,65,166,134><AREA title="2009: 436" shape=rect alt="" coords=174,31,185,134></MAP>

Filter Deaths By Year
<HR><HR>U.S. Fatalities in and around Afghanistan

<TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" id=ctl00_ContentPlaceHolder1_gvTheatre class=Smalltable border=1 rules=all cellSpacing=0><TBODY><TR class=contactDept><TH scope=col>Country of Death</TH><TH scope=col>Fatalities</TH></TR><TR><TD class=contact>Afghanistan</TD><TD class=contactNumber>786</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contact>Germany (from wounds in theatre)</TD><TD class=contactNumber>10</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contact>Pakistan</TD><TD class=contactNumber>12</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contact>USA (from wounds in theatre)</TD><TD class=contactNumber>16</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contact>Uzbekistan</TD><TD class=contactNumber>1</TD></TR><TR class=contactDept><TD>Total</TD><TD align=right>825</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
View Details: U.S. Fatalities In and Around Afghanistan
<HR>IED Fatalities

<STYLE type=text/css>img{ border-style: none; cursor: pointer;} </STYLE><TABLE id=tCountries class=Smalltable><TBODY><TR><TH>Period</TH><TH>IED</TH><TH>Total</TH><TH>Pct</TH></TR><TR><TD class=contactNumber>2001</TD><TD class=contactNumber>0</TD><TD class=contactNumber>4</TD><TD class=contactNumber>0.00</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contactNumber>2002</TD><TD class=contactNumber>4</TD><TD class=contactNumber>25</TD><TD class=contactNumber>16.00</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contactNumber>2003</TD><TD class=contactNumber>3</TD><TD class=contactNumber>26</TD><TD class=contactNumber>11.54</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contactNumber>2004</TD><TD class=contactNumber>12</TD><TD class=contactNumber>27</TD><TD class=contactNumber>44.44</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contactNumber>2005</TD><TD class=contactNumber>20</TD><TD class=contactNumber>73</TD><TD class=contactNumber>27.40</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contactNumber>2006</TD><TD class=contactNumber>41</TD><TD class=contactNumber>130</TD><TD class=contactNumber>31.54</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contactNumber>2007</TD><TD class=contactNumber>78</TD><TD class=contactNumber>184</TD><TD class=contactNumber>42.39</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contactNumber>2008</TD><TD class=contactNumber>152</TD><TD class=contactNumber>263</TD><TD class=contactNumber>57.79</TD></TR><TR><TD class=contactNumber>2009</TD><TD class=contactNumber>225</TD><TD class=contactNumber>376</TD><TD class=contactNumber>59.84</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
 
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