Nascar
- Thread starter albanygt40
- Start date
Terry Oxandale
Skinny Man
Sorry Dave. I'd like to help if I could, but science has shown that the appeal of NASCAR cannot be supported by any known debatable qualities (something to do with its effects on the dopamine/Bush Lite level of the viewer).
I gave up on NASCAR just after the "Awesome Bill" days. Periodically I look back at a race or two, shake my head, and turn to something else wondering to myself, "Is F1 going to follow the same fate?"
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Ox
I gave up on NASCAR just after the "Awesome Bill" days. Periodically I look back at a race or two, shake my head, and turn to something else wondering to myself, "Is F1 going to follow the same fate?"
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Fan and former crew here...
Many people don't appreciate just what those drivers are dealing with out there..
Their cars (particularly with restrictor plates) are not very responsive nor good handling (in terms of common road racing cars).. They have tires that are on wheels that are too small with traction patches that are too narrow for the weight the cars carry.
Now put all that into perspective by putting them in traffic 3-4 wide in the corners at 170-200 MPH..
I have a great deal of respect for most all the drivers in the series (a couple I could care less about).. Marcos Ambrose is one of my favorites and if you read stories based around his experience in NASCAR, you'll find that he concurs (or I with him) on the ill handling nature of these cars and what the drivers are doing with them...
My only *real* gripe is that they don't race in the rain..
Many people don't appreciate just what those drivers are dealing with out there..
Their cars (particularly with restrictor plates) are not very responsive nor good handling (in terms of common road racing cars).. They have tires that are on wheels that are too small with traction patches that are too narrow for the weight the cars carry.
Now put all that into perspective by putting them in traffic 3-4 wide in the corners at 170-200 MPH..
I have a great deal of respect for most all the drivers in the series (a couple I could care less about).. Marcos Ambrose is one of my favorites and if you read stories based around his experience in NASCAR, you'll find that he concurs (or I with him) on the ill handling nature of these cars and what the drivers are doing with them...
My only *real* gripe is that they don't race in the rain..
Hi Randy
I can only imagine the feeling of another car attached to your bumper at 200mph pushing you around the track.....balls, big ones I would say. 4 wide in a corner will end tears. Talladega had a few spills. When I head to the States I'm going to a NASCAR race. Is there any hire/drive days you do in a de-tuned NASCAR? I would love to tear up an Oval.
Randy what is your involvement now?
I can only imagine the feeling of another car attached to your bumper at 200mph pushing you around the track.....balls, big ones I would say. 4 wide in a corner will end tears. Talladega had a few spills. When I head to the States I'm going to a NASCAR race. Is there any hire/drive days you do in a de-tuned NASCAR? I would love to tear up an Oval.
Randy what is your involvement now?
Dave S,
Check out www.drivepetty.com
Various programs and track schedules on the site. Highly recommended!
Limit you to 150 MPH last I knew, may have changed now. Around $1300.00
drive yourself and $200.00 for ride along at 165MPH.
Check out www.drivepetty.com
Various programs and track schedules on the site. Highly recommended!
Limit you to 150 MPH last I knew, may have changed now. Around $1300.00
drive yourself and $200.00 for ride along at 165MPH.
At least NASCAR doesn't have a regulatory body with a 70 year old former leader who likes nazi role-play group sex with women 1/3 his age (Max Mosley). That man is seriously sick.
Nor does it have another old codger egotist who siphons off enough money to now be a billionaire (Bernie Ecclestone)....and, who is borderline deranged .
I'll take NASCAR beer swilling over that any day. Plus it's great to see a good looking woman out there kicking some butt too.
Nor does it have another old codger egotist who siphons off enough money to now be a billionaire (Bernie Ecclestone)....and, who is borderline deranged .
I'll take NASCAR beer swilling over that any day. Plus it's great to see a good looking woman out there kicking some butt too.
Terry Oxandale
Skinny Man
I wouldn't give the France family business model too high a marks as compared to other racing business practices.
There is more to life than just driving around in circles.
I do like the rolex series. Having two separate groups of cars makes it very intersting. Traffic creates some great racing.
I do like the rolex series. Having two separate groups of cars makes it very intersting. Traffic creates some great racing.
"Turn left and go fast" is not as easy as one would believe. With the poor aero and heavy minimum weight, it makes for some interesting racing. The set-up on the cars for the high banking at various tracks is almost a "must read". Just check out the tire pressures left side to right side for an inkling. I do find oval racing a bit boring, but I do appreciate the talents involved.
I agree with Molleur, I admire the skill it takes to navigate the ovals at 200 mph in a pack of cars, but that doesn't mean it's interesting.
Kinda like brain surgery, I admire the skill it takes to do it, but it is boring as hell to watch.
I do like to watch watch NASCAR on road courses, though.
Kinda like brain surgery, I admire the skill it takes to do it, but it is boring as hell to watch.
I do like to watch watch NASCAR on road courses, though.
Jeff Young
GT40s Supporter
I was a NASCAR regular from age 5 (in 1975) until the late 80s. Back then, NASCAR was sort of a little secret that we had in the Southeast. The racing was astounding, particularly in the 80s -- close, accessible, good personalties, decent tech. I liked Indy car and F1 too, but the high drama of NASCAR just blew me away. You can't watch the end of the 76 or 79 Daytona 500s and not see why NASCAR is so big today.
Here's what killed it for me though, in no particular order:
1. End of accessiblity/personality. My dad and I used to go to the same hardware store in SC that Cale Yarborough did. You could walk around the pits at Darlington and talk to just about any driver. Richard Petty was just about the nicest guy you could come across, etc. etc. etc. These guys were NOT prima donnas, and not little 5'7" copies of some sponsor friendly cut out. David Pearson, Tim Richmond, Darrell Waltrip, Buddy Baker, Jimmy "Smut" Means (imagine a sponsor today hiring a guy with that nickname), Joe Ruttman, Ron Bouchard, Lake Speed, Dick Brooks, Bobby Allison, Benny Parson, Ironhead (hated him), neil Bonnett, Harry Gant -- all of those guys had personality.
2. Money. Used to be a good Winston Cup car cost maybe 50k, and it was a tech marvel for what it was. Find the mid80s Road and Track where Harry Hyde and Tim Richmond took a (cheated up) Monte Carlo SS and beat the snot out of a Porsche 962 at a high speed test at the big Goodyear test oval. Excessive money/testing/tech kills racing, like in F1, and in Indycar in the 80s, and now NASCAR.
3. The "spec" car. Until the late 80s, I could look out at the track and see Richard Petty in PONTIAC, and Ironfart in a CHEVY, and Harry Gant in a BUICK, and Bill Elliot in a FORD and know what the cars were. It's maybe a small thing, but losing the manufacturer identity to essentialy a spec car I think has hurt the sport.
4. Loss of teh short tracks/small venues. 15 years ago, Nascar started to ditch places like North Wilkesboro and Rockingham for the cookie-cutter 1.5 ovals in Vegas, kansas city, etc. Mistake. The racing on the 1.5 ovals sucks. At Wilkesboro and Rockingham? Awesome.
5. The retirement of the bias ply tire and the rise of aero. Yes, it was old, old tech. But the bias ply tire really allowed the driver to drive the car. In the 80s, you'd sit and watch guys basicaly drive the car sideways through the corners, with smoke off the right rear. Now, the radial, plus the aero crap, means a parade in the low line. The new car has admitedly helped change this some, but still, the fact remains, you CAN'T run the Petty/Gant line up against the wall like you used to. Tires and aero changed this.
6. This Chase BS. I hate it.
Here's what killed it for me though, in no particular order:
1. End of accessiblity/personality. My dad and I used to go to the same hardware store in SC that Cale Yarborough did. You could walk around the pits at Darlington and talk to just about any driver. Richard Petty was just about the nicest guy you could come across, etc. etc. etc. These guys were NOT prima donnas, and not little 5'7" copies of some sponsor friendly cut out. David Pearson, Tim Richmond, Darrell Waltrip, Buddy Baker, Jimmy "Smut" Means (imagine a sponsor today hiring a guy with that nickname), Joe Ruttman, Ron Bouchard, Lake Speed, Dick Brooks, Bobby Allison, Benny Parson, Ironhead (hated him), neil Bonnett, Harry Gant -- all of those guys had personality.
2. Money. Used to be a good Winston Cup car cost maybe 50k, and it was a tech marvel for what it was. Find the mid80s Road and Track where Harry Hyde and Tim Richmond took a (cheated up) Monte Carlo SS and beat the snot out of a Porsche 962 at a high speed test at the big Goodyear test oval. Excessive money/testing/tech kills racing, like in F1, and in Indycar in the 80s, and now NASCAR.
3. The "spec" car. Until the late 80s, I could look out at the track and see Richard Petty in PONTIAC, and Ironfart in a CHEVY, and Harry Gant in a BUICK, and Bill Elliot in a FORD and know what the cars were. It's maybe a small thing, but losing the manufacturer identity to essentialy a spec car I think has hurt the sport.
4. Loss of teh short tracks/small venues. 15 years ago, Nascar started to ditch places like North Wilkesboro and Rockingham for the cookie-cutter 1.5 ovals in Vegas, kansas city, etc. Mistake. The racing on the 1.5 ovals sucks. At Wilkesboro and Rockingham? Awesome.
5. The retirement of the bias ply tire and the rise of aero. Yes, it was old, old tech. But the bias ply tire really allowed the driver to drive the car. In the 80s, you'd sit and watch guys basicaly drive the car sideways through the corners, with smoke off the right rear. Now, the radial, plus the aero crap, means a parade in the low line. The new car has admitedly helped change this some, but still, the fact remains, you CAN'T run the Petty/Gant line up against the wall like you used to. Tires and aero changed this.
6. This Chase BS. I hate it.
