No SL C Components

[Mike]

Just to let you know, some of you have suggested that I give RCR a call to get parts for a RCR SL C build. I just spoke with a gentleman, who I assume was Fran as he kept making referrences to the things "he" had done in developing the car, and he says that the only way he sells the SL C is in complete package form. I don't care for the electronics, steering components, pedal assembly, or any of the suspension components. I have plenty of those sitting around my shop off other "real" race cars I can use, but the only way RCR will sell an SL C is as a $45k package. That's pretty darn expensive for a vehicle without any drive train and it's questionable whether it can even be registered. It's not a real race car, and it's not really a street car. It's somewhere in between. Classic territory for a kit car, but when it's all said and done I would bet you end up with a $75,000 or more vehicle that may or may not be registerable. Granted it is a lot of car for the price, but if one is going to spend THAT kind of $$, there are many more vehicles that are more refined, finished, and registerable.

Fran, I love the vehicle, but you're pushing it into an area most kit car builders are not going to go into, IMHO, and the guys with that type of $$$ aren't gonna want to have to assemble anything. Guess that's why you're going down the Aspira road. I wonder how much a turnkey car from them is going to be?

If you can't tell, I for one, am very disappointed that this "kit" won't be available in a basic form.:cry::sad::sad::shout:

 

[chuck smith]

hard to blame Fran for wanting to keep the car as he designed it

 

[Fran Hall RCR]

Crash,
yes you did speak to me ..thanks for your insight but the 22 SL-C's we have sold in short order seem to suggest otherwise.

I look forward to seeing what you do actually build as you have so many components available to you maybe a scratch build would be more your style...(dont forget to bill $$ yourself for all the hours in design and manufacture)...I think you will be very surprised how expensive your own car will become once you start making custom windscreens which are DOT compliant and developing a set of production moulds that produce body panels in the same class as the SL-C.

The SL-C is definately street legal and registerable .....hence the reason for spending time and resources on DOT complaint lighting packages and windscreen...

There are many cars available such as the Mosler or the Saleen that are not race cars and are compromised street cars also that cost significantly more than a completed SL-C with a better spec drivetrain...

 

[J. Salmon]

the "he" is Fran, and the car is his vision and design. Before starting on a project like an SLC, I'd be certain of the rules and regs in your area for registration. As for the extra parts, have you seen the car in person? You don't care for the billet suspension components specifically developed for the chassis? If you have that much interest in fabrication, why not build your own car from the ground up and use all the stuff you have laying around? Or sell the stuff you have laying around and use the proceeds for a complete kit?

If I were Fran I would never sell just a body and chassis for fear the finished product would reflect negatively upon my company.


I was too slow on the typing!

 

[Mike]

I have built roughly 6 cars from nothing but tube and body work. I understand all too well the costs involved in manufacturering the body components. That's why when I saw the complete kit was about 45k, I had hoped that the complete body and maybe the tub would be available for considerably cheaper.

I have these things available to me:
BBS three piece wheels. Centernut.
FABCAR type uprights. Lola B06/10 spec
Brembo carbon/carbon brakes.
Motec EMS and dash.
Set of Quantum shocks.
Many odds and ends. (plumbing,fastners,CVs, etc)

I envision something of a "super" Superlight Coupe.
The brakes would be messy so probably stay with steels, but I got those too.
I was hoping a Lozano Brothers 310 Ford was still in the shop somewhere, but it's not looking good, so probably an LS3 or 3 rotor as I have the 3 rotor or the LS3 is cheap for what you get. The trannies in the shop, a Ricardo and Hewland are all WAY to valuable to send out the back door to me, so the tranny would be the Ricardo Fran sells with a sequential conversion.

I'm not attempting to beat up Fran in any way. He is producing what I had in mind. The only issues I have are that it would be a waste for me to buy all that stuff and not use it, and I don't think the car is optimized to what it could be with a specific setup. I understand that Fran wanted to keep it universal, and I am not faulting him for that, I just know how hard it is to get all the details of a body to the point where I would consider driving it around town and am extremely disappointed he won't sell anything but a complete plus kit.

 

[Fran Hall RCR]

Understood......but I am in business to stay in business afterall.

 

[Mike]

You know, I have been researching kit cars quite a bit and I understand why you don't want to post prices online, except at your website, but I think I am a little unclear as to what one gets from you when they purchase an SL C or a GT40 for that matter. It sounds like your company actually fits everything and essentially completes the car. Then the drivetrain is removed and it is delivered to the customer? Is this the case with your SL C package? Is all the fitting of seams done on the SL C? Is all the suspension mounted and aligned? Does it leave your shop basically a roller ready for reinstallation of engine and transmission? Does the buyer provide everything to you so it can be fitted and then it's disassembled and then shipped? Just what exactly is the process and how long does it usually take?

Forgive me if you have already gone through this. I have read many threads on here, but certainly not all of them. I did thouroughly read "Few questions about the SLC" but if I missed something or if it is posted somewhere else, could you please point me in the right direction?

 

[Craig Gillingham]

crash...buy it complete and sell on the stuff you dont want? that way you can muller it to suit you and recoup some cash.

 

[Mike]

Sell it to who? I mean if everyone has to buy a complete package, the market for these parts would seem to me to be slim to nonexistant. Would you want to buy them?

I was thinking more if RCR DID do the entire build, then maybe I could work with them and then have them do the first semi final assembly just so they would know that it was kosher and I wasn't just trying to steal their design work on anything. I'm an engineer and have been working in the auto racing industry for some 20 years. I don't feel my work would be any sort of a detraction or issue to RCR. On the contrary, my work is highly detailed and battle proven.

 

[Mesa]

Crash -
you probably could do a great job in making a super slc ..... but many of us can't (or don't have the time) so we need all the ready made help we can get. No offense to you, but I wouldnt want to see an slc with VW gearbox, suspension and wheels (all goofy toe)out there laying waste to the slc ''name''. all while sitting at some car show trying to pass itself off as a super car (think any number of kit cars over the years). RCR does not want to screen customers, so they just produce as complete car as they can. this hopefully increases the odds of a high quality finished product that all slc owners would be proud of.

 

[Jay V]

Sell it to who? I mean if everyone has to buy a complete package, the market for these parts would seem to me to be slim to nonexistant. Would you want to buy them?

Wouldn't the number one market be, for at least one of the 22+ people who have bought one, the guy that prangs one and needs the spare part? Sure enough, that out of all those buyers, one is gonna do it. Yes, I doubt you'll get top dollar for the pieces.

If you can wait a little bit, I might buy them after I get a SL-C "LeMans" and "do the 'crash' deed". I 'bet' Jac would agree with me, that I would do that deed. Hope to not be the first one there....

 

[Mike]

Hey Craig7L or JayV if you know anybody that would be interested in an SL C minus everything but the bodywork, all attached items to the bodywork (lights, windows, hinges, latches, etc), diffuser, wing, and tub, I'd be willing to write a check for $25k right now. I'd also want the Ricardo option and would pay for it's full cost. You could have a complete set of spares on hand for around $19k.

I love the car, I just am having a tough time writting a check for that much money in these economic times and can't see buying all that stuff, when I have the same or better components sitting in my shop.

Besides that, my wife heard me talking about another car and said she wants just under $70k worth of house improvements done. Guess I'm gonna be waiting awhile if Fran doesn't want to break up the package......or someone wants to take me up on the offer.

 

[Jac Mac]

If you can wait a little bit, I might buy them after I get a SL-C "LeMans" and "do the 'crash' deed". I 'bet' Jac would agree with me, that I would do that deed. Hope to not be the first one there....

What deed? Jay you have still got to get that MkIV finished let alone prang it, or have you put it in the 'TOO Hard" basket already!

 

[ArnieSmith]

Crash,
$45K is a BARGAIN for a SL-C. Actually, all of the RCR lineup is a bargain. With current increases in material costs, Fran should be pricing ALL of the cars higher than he is.
Also, the cost of Gas, Electricity, Insurance and Labor is not going down. Just check your own electric or gas bill from 1 year ago and compare to todays. Did it drop in price?
Yeah, if I were you I would be concerned about dropping $45K on a car. Wait awhile, then you can pay $47K or $52K or…..
Go for the aluminum siding and the sweet dinette set.

 

[Randy V]

Crash,
$45K is a BARGAIN for a SL-C. Actually, all of the RCR lineup is a bargain. With current increases in material costs, Fran should be pricing ALL of the cars higher than he is.
Also, the cost of Gas, Electricity, Insurance and Labor is not going down. Just check your own electric or gas bill from 1 year ago and compare to todays. Did it drop in price?
Yeah, if I were you I would be concerned about dropping $45K on a car. Wait awhile, then you can pay $47K or $52K or…..
Go for the aluminum siding and the sweet dinette set.

I agree...

Crash -
I sincerely doubt that RCR is trying to recoup all it's SL-C development costs within the first 30 shipments... If the SL-C were a "knock-off" of any other car, the development costs for RCR would have been substantially reduced. But it's not. I'm certain that while some components of the SL-C are compatible with other RCR models - I would see this as a "PLUS"...


I've got a shop and warehouse full of Racecar "stuff" that I've had for years and still periodically add to the collection.
When I first decided to pull the trigger on the RCR40 I have now, I used to bug the heck out of Fran to see if I could buy his base model and just mix/match add components from the other two packages above mine...

I sat down one night taking stock of what it was about to build. A GT40 with shocks and springs from a Late Model racecar, Wheels from China, a single seat shell that came out of God only knows what GT40 kit from years ago, a kludged together AC System, Wilwood brake calipers from my pile of spares and my own fabrication skills for countless items that would have been included in the higher level "Deluxe Plus" package..
My timeline is open with no end date required but I figured that if I had to source all the components I needed and fabricate those that are within my skillset - well - it started looking like any reasonable chance at producing a nice GT40 would take me a couple of years more than if I purchased the full meal deal...

I'm glad that I got the Deluxe Plus from RCR. It's quite complete and I've saved over a thousand hours... Now my build is going slow right now because of my family and job obligations - but I know that when it's finished it will be a top-notch car that I built with RCR's help...

Remember - Everybody deserves the chance to put shoes on the kids feet and food on the table..

 

[Cliff Beer]

Crash, you might happen to find a half finished or incomplete GT40 project if you have the luxury of time. In the last year or so I've seen several of these go by, and, for $ amounts considerably less than $40K.

Fran sells a wonderful package (GT40 or SLC) which is competitively priced, reflects exquisit workmanship and comes with unparalled post-sale support. Sounds like it's not the thing for you as you already have a boat load of relevant parts so this other route I'm suggesting might be a better way to go. You might find a half-built/incomplete GT40 project from any number of kit providers including GTD, Tornado, ERA, KVA - some of whom are in business, and some not. So, best to educate yourself a little about the various pros/cons (monocoque or tube chassis, etc.). I'm sure you'll have a good time pulling all the pieces together and have an even better time when you have it on the road, and track!

 

[Mike]

Thanks for not beating up on me too much. I know this is Frans territory here on this forum. I also know that just looking at the pictures that Fran builds a heck of a car at a reasonable price. I'm a builder and a racer, and even though it makes fiscal sense to buy it as a unit, I can't stand to have something like this completely "ready made". The real satisfaction to me is not making the body seams perfect, even though that is important to me, but in putting my know how and experience to work and optimizing a vehicle. Again not knocking Fran, but I see a lot of places I think I can improve upon, in an already great design.

 

[Jac Mac]

Crash, I think you have answered your own question, you want your own car along the style & lines of the SLC, Simple go build it, body-everything, just remember that RCR have set a benchmark by which you will be judged-like it or not-tall order, but if you have the talents you claim it shouldnt be beyond your capabilities-heck, you might even be able to improve on it slightly You have to remember the SLC is Frans baby, I doubt that if you had rocked up to the front door of Ford in 1964 and said ''' Hey I like the style of that GT40 thing your building, can I have a body to drop over all my bits & pieces because I am not that fussed on what you have done ''' that you would have got much of a hearing.

 

[Craig Gillingham]

crash33 - can see your point of view ... that it would seem its the building, tinkering and self satisfaction that floats your boat in cars..nothing wrong with that.

From my standpoint, i am only interested in this car if the standard is the same across the board and its ultimate overall image is more than a "kit" car. Accepted than trans / engines will vary like HV production cars
Time and lack of total technical knowledge restricts me from self building so also need the purchasing options exactly as they stand. Its the driving, ownership and usage of the car that floats my boat.

At the end of the day its RCRs decision where its future market and potential lies and how it presents the car to the punter.

 

[Dimi Terleckyj]

Unfortunately the powers that be also dictate the direction that can be taken.

Here in NSW, Sydney unless you buy someone elses finished registered car you can't register a turnkey.

We have no alternative but to build our own or forget about it altogether.

Sad but true.

Dimi