I'm really wanting to build an SL-C but my buddy who has a modified Nissan GT-R keep saying how the technology yada yada would smoke an SL-C on the track, drag race etc. Please inform me on how he is completely wrong in all aspects. I showed him a youtube video on a Ford GT smoked a GT-R but he was making even more excuses.
Please entertain my ignorance
- Thread starter Turbohips
- Start date
If you want to build one, then why not take the challenge and see? You can't argue with a head to head (track) test.
It will depend upon how modified your friend's car is and the drivetrain you select for your SLC. As a rough guide, look at the power to weight ratios - the latest GT-R is very heavy (1700+kg). In the wet, four wheel drive will give an advantage. I'd expect just about any driver to walk all over the GT-R in the dry.
It will depend upon how modified your friend's car is and the drivetrain you select for your SLC. As a rough guide, look at the power to weight ratios - the latest GT-R is very heavy (1700+kg). In the wet, four wheel drive will give an advantage. I'd expect just about any driver to walk all over the GT-R in the dry.
We have actually run on track against a modified GTR....at the Autobahn track near Chicago....
There was no contest , the GTR is very heavy even when stripped out as a race car, power to weight is a big deal even with AWD and turbos...
To prove the p/w theory to your pal, you can show him a youtube video of our single seat Nemesis walking away from a Ford GT ...and that's only in 160hp trim...
There was no contest , the GTR is very heavy even when stripped out as a race car, power to weight is a big deal even with AWD and turbos...
To prove the p/w theory to your pal, you can show him a youtube video of our single seat Nemesis walking away from a Ford GT ...and that's only in 160hp trim...
I like your new ride John...very cool and should send the blood pumping to all the right places...
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Build what YOU want, who cares what your buddy wants? Let him take his GTR and race you at your nearest facility. 
As for modified - that is far too general. My modified GTR is unlikely to be the same as yours, we will have different goals/budgets/priorities.
IMO the new GTR is a hell of a car but heavy, and has far too much in the way of gizmos. I will stick to my R33.
IMO - For equal race track performance : easier to start with an SL-C and have basic physics on your side from the start. At the extreme I'd be backing the SL-C.
As for drags I have no idea, no interest in it, but maybe the AWD and DSG would counter the mass and aero of the SL-C to some extent, but once again unknown mods/ development make this a tough comparison.
The GTR suffers a little in this comparison trying to be too many things for too many people. YOUR SL-C would be built to suit you. No need to modify.
Also, I know which one would be easier to work on.
But really they are very different things - I'd take both.
Tim.
As for modified - that is far too general. My modified GTR is unlikely to be the same as yours, we will have different goals/budgets/priorities.
IMO the new GTR is a hell of a car but heavy, and has far too much in the way of gizmos. I will stick to my R33.
IMO - For equal race track performance : easier to start with an SL-C and have basic physics on your side from the start. At the extreme I'd be backing the SL-C.
As for drags I have no idea, no interest in it, but maybe the AWD and DSG would counter the mass and aero of the SL-C to some extent, but once again unknown mods/ development make this a tough comparison.
The GTR suffers a little in this comparison trying to be too many things for too many people. YOUR SL-C would be built to suit you. No need to modify.
Also, I know which one would be easier to work on.
But really they are very different things - I'd take both.
Tim.
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Bruce, I have to ask: Do you want to convince your GTR-owning friend of something, or do you really want to convince yourself?
If it's the former, I'd say don't bother. Many people have a vested interest in justifying what they've already done (in his case buying and modifying a GT-R), and will only get angry, defensive, and increasingly irrational when faced with facts. The more time and money they have invested, the more this will be true.
For your own edification, there are two things that ultimately determine track performance: Power-to-weight, and total tire grip. All other considerations (downforce, CG height, better brakes, suspension tuning, electronic engine and stability controls, etc.) are peripheral concerns whose only function is to either maximize the vehicle's power and/or total tire grip, or its ability to use the power and grip to their fullest potential.
Remember that ultimate tire grip goes down as the weight of the vehicle increases. The converse is also obviously true. The $1.7 million, 1200 HP Veyron is a marvel of technology, but a $5K-$10K no-tech shifter kart will run away and hide from it on a roadrace track.
The GT-R is a blue-collar Veyron. The SLC is a rich man's shifter kart...
JR
If it's the former, I'd say don't bother. Many people have a vested interest in justifying what they've already done (in his case buying and modifying a GT-R), and will only get angry, defensive, and increasingly irrational when faced with facts. The more time and money they have invested, the more this will be true.
For your own edification, there are two things that ultimately determine track performance: Power-to-weight, and total tire grip. All other considerations (downforce, CG height, better brakes, suspension tuning, electronic engine and stability controls, etc.) are peripheral concerns whose only function is to either maximize the vehicle's power and/or total tire grip, or its ability to use the power and grip to their fullest potential.
Remember that ultimate tire grip goes down as the weight of the vehicle increases. The converse is also obviously true. The $1.7 million, 1200 HP Veyron is a marvel of technology, but a $5K-$10K no-tech shifter kart will run away and hide from it on a roadrace track.
The GT-R is a blue-collar Veyron. The SLC is a rich man's shifter kart...
JR
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I would totally agree with John and Tim. Do it for yourself and let the proof be in the fruits of your labor. While I'm sure the GTR is one heck of a great car and chalked full of every technological gizmo and gadget available, IMO it is definitely not a head turner. Looks wise I'd compare it to a Mustang crossed with an Altima... does nothing for me. You would think that for $100K the looks dept. would match the performance.
I can only imagine what you could get out of the SLC if you took the same amount of $$ that it took to buy a base GTR plus modifications and put that into an SLC.
I can only imagine what you could get out of the SLC if you took the same amount of $$ that it took to buy a base GTR plus modifications and put that into an SLC.
Sounds like your friend needs to visit a race track!
We have been on track with several GT-R's and none of them have been able to stick within 3-4 seconds of our car per lap, and we had a very basic engine package at the time. Plus, I might be a Nissan race car driver...but the GT-R is not good looking at all...
The Superlite on the other hand :thumbsup:
Overall:
Natural weight balance, aerodynamics, weight, and much more plays in the SL-C's favor. What plays into the GT-R's favor? I can't think of any advantage it has.
Just because I love GTRs and someone mentioned Veyrons - http://youtu.be/xMMSi25svTo
A proper GTR with a proper GTR engine (slightly modified... A bit).
I agree the new one is fugly and the engine, well it just isn't the same as the old RB26.
Love my R33 GTR. Love my RB26.
Pardon the interruption.
Advantages? GTR has AWD, active diff's and DSG. Not sure SL-C has these, yet anyway. Probably better off without the added mass etc. Electronic gizmos - meh...
Racetrack: SL-C wins. Horses for courses.
Tim.
A proper GTR with a proper GTR engine (slightly modified... A bit).
I agree the new one is fugly and the engine, well it just isn't the same as the old RB26.
Love my R33 GTR. Love my RB26.
Pardon the interruption.
Advantages? GTR has AWD, active diff's and DSG. Not sure SL-C has these, yet anyway. Probably better off without the added mass etc. Electronic gizmos - meh...
Racetrack: SL-C wins. Horses for courses.
Tim.
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Not an SLC, but my Razor is quicker through the corners than the GTRs I've ran with (at Spring Mountain). I was also running crappy street tires and about 175hp at the time. Lap times were just 5 seconds shy of his (2:51 vs 2:46 or so). The only real production car I'd be worried about is a PROPERLY driven Viper ACR. Those things are insane, when piloted well.
Just my experience. But I'd listen to the guy just a couple posts up.
Edit: Almost forgot!!! My lap times at the Las Vegas Classic Course were identical to a stock GTR on "race" tires (not stock as far as I knew). Lap times were a smidge over 2:01. LVCC is a much tighter course with one long back straight. That's the only area I would ever get passed. Ha!!! There's nothing like the looks you get when you pass an M3 on the outside of the corner, 5+ mph faster than him. Good times!!!
Just my experience. But I'd listen to the guy just a couple posts up.
Edit: Almost forgot!!! My lap times at the Las Vegas Classic Course were identical to a stock GTR on "race" tires (not stock as far as I knew). Lap times were a smidge over 2:01. LVCC is a much tighter course with one long back straight. That's the only area I would ever get passed. Ha!!! There's nothing like the looks you get when you pass an M3 on the outside of the corner, 5+ mph faster than him. Good times!!!
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Just because I love GTRs and someone mentioned Veyrons - Bugatti Veyron vs Nissan Skyline GTR R34 (1200Hp).mp4 - YouTube
A proper GTR with a proper GTR engine (slightly modified... A bit).
I agree the new one is fugly and the engine, well it just isn't the same as the old RB26.
Love my R33 GTR. Love my RB26.
Pardon the interruption.
Advantages? GTR has AWD, active diff's and DSG. Not sure SL-C has these, yet anyway. Probably better off without the added mass etc. Electronic gizmos - meh...
Racetrack: SL-C wins. Horses for courses.
Tim.
Key word is yet...build an SLC with all of those and... :shocked:
Your friend sounds like someone that cannot be reasoned with using logic. As John alluded to, you could try pointing him towards the works of Colin Chapman. The GT-R is too heavy to really be competitive. The AWD makes it great from a dig, assuming something doesn't break, but that's about it. Heck, a properly modified Corvette would be plenty of competition for your friend's modified GT-R. The SL-C is a step above.
I found the following video recently. It isn't of an SL-C, but it's in the ball park (Mid-engined with a LS and a transaxle). It's running around the track and nothing comes close to keeping up with it. The Palatov D2 is only using mechanical grip. The SL-C looks much better and has the addition of more downforce with better aerodynamics.
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpfoVC4sw4M"]Jonathan drives the Palatov D2 at Laguna Seca[/ame]
I found the following video recently. It isn't of an SL-C, but it's in the ball park (Mid-engined with a LS and a transaxle). It's running around the track and nothing comes close to keeping up with it. The Palatov D2 is only using mechanical grip. The SL-C looks much better and has the addition of more downforce with better aerodynamics.
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpfoVC4sw4M"]Jonathan drives the Palatov D2 at Laguna Seca[/ame]
Thanks for all the replies guys I think I just needed the extra nudge honestly. It's just seems like a lot of work to build one and my work schedule is ridiculous. I'm out of town 3 weeks out of each month and have a 1 year old girl. Not much time to do anything else but pamper her when I'm home. I simply need to figure out how to manage my work and personal time better I guess.
I hear ya! I'm going to school full time (off this summer though because I'm having minor spine surgery to help my sciatica) and have a 16 month old girl. I was military for 10.5 years and got out from medical issues (flew on an HH60G as a gunner). Anyways, I'm restarting my life and will be ready for an SLC, LMP, D type, Nemesis, Mark IV, (or whatever I like this month...) within a few years.
I can tell you from my experiences with the Superlite Razor that the engineering in this car is phenomenal! The body work (untouched) is the best in the business. And this car has been one of the most fun cars I've ever owned (out of numerous cars). If you can wait and save a little more, there's a couple of SLC builders out there that do excellent work. So that's another option.
A gunner on a Pave Hawk is pretty exposed.
I was a gunner on an M60 7.62 in Uncle Sam's Motorcycle Club.
