Wiring harness questions for RHD RF cars

[Mark Worthington]

Hi guys. I am getting ready to finish mount my fuel system and mount the right hand side (RHS) tank, but it occured to me that I should complete the wiring of the pumps while I still have the tank off. So I dug out my box with the wiring harnesses and my manual and realized that the Main Wiring Harness is where the fuel pumps and 2-way valve connect. As I bagan to lay out the harness and label the connectors, I came up with a few questions.

1) I assume I jump the power lead for the RHS shut-off solenoid to the RHS LP pump?

2) It seems a dedicated ground into the chassis near each of the LP pumps would be a good idea. I was going to drill nd tap an 8-32 thread into the chassis near the pumps and tie all ground wires to that lug. Then I realized there's a black wire near the HP pump wire in the harness. I assume this is a ground for the HP pump and that I can tie my other grounds (LP pump, solenoid, 2-way valve) into this. Any better alternatives?

3) Can someone post a picture of the physical layout of the main wiring harness, particularly near the pumps and in the engine bay? Thanks.

 

[Ron Earp]

Mark, you might want to consult with Dan. When I saw Hershal (too bad he isn't writing any more, he could fill in) he mentioned Dan had trouble with his wiring harness in that is was not correct at all. I'm told Dan got a replacement from the factory and it was one of the last things out in the last few months, clearly not obtainable now.

Anyhow, the harness was wrong and I didn't know it but when Dan started using it it wouldn't match up correctly and I'm told clearly was buggered. So, before you start messing with it you might best get ahold of Dan and check because your car and my old car were made within weeks of one another - I imagine the harness suffered similarly.

In the worst case for the car wiring by a Painless or similar harness and be done with it, if you are using carb all will be simple. Deal with EFI harness on your own because I think John S. had problems with his RF supplied Motec/EFI harness and his was the old one, like yours.

Ron

 

Mark, I'll look at mine tonight when I get home and see what help I can provide. Mine went together just fine.

 

[Mark Worthington]

Thanks, guys. Pat, I'm particularly interested in the routing of the main wiring harness aft of the rear cabin bulkhead. I'm puzzled by the fact that my harness has the lead for the RHS LP pump a couple feet from the leads for the HP pump, when they hould all pretty much be in the same location.

Ron, I don't think I'm going to have too many problems with my harness, because the earlier RF cars (mine is chassis # 36 and was shipped in early 2000) seem pretty solid. I'm just a little disoriented because I have a wiring diagram for each of the various harnesses, but only a shematic for how/where the harnesses are, no descriptions or pictures of how the harnesses should be physically routed on the car. Hopefully all I need to do is cut open a short length of sleeve to get at the wires I need.

I will say one thing, plumbing the fuel system in that tight little space beneath the right engine bay sill is a royal pain in the ass. Not only do you have to avoid the shifter rod and the lower trailing arm, but I've also added a solenoid and a pre-HP-pump filter, along with bulky (and expensive) 1/2" Earl's fuel line. I really want to finish up this task and move on to my powertrain installation.

 

[Ron Earp]

Mark, I think yours was ordered in 2000, around September, and arrived, as I recall, around December 2000 or January 2001. Definitely didn't come to the states in early 2000. I met Hershal for the first time in TX at Bob Lawerence's right after he took delivery of the car and that was like in Jan or Feb of 2001. Mine was ordered in October 2000 a few days after yours was ordered by Bob Lawerence in Texas, and it showed up in April 2001. It was chassis 44, the second into the US. Then my beloved Sydney came a few months later and work on the car got HARD to do! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

I hope you don't have issues, but these cars were unique in that they were the first "complete kits" ever made by Roaring Forties. Until Bob and I asked for these they'd not been done for export before and it was a learning experience for RF. Not even sure they'd been done in OZ because Robert was going on about how resourceful Ozzy builders were and they didn't need complete kits. But, I was not as experienced back then and neither was Bob, so we insisted on it. Now I'd just say give me a body, suspension, glass, trim, and let me to it. Anyhow, Bob had some drop links that were wrong and needed replacing, as well as a few other little odds and ends and I had some stuff that needed sorting too, which RF did easily and quickly back in the day.

In fact, RF didn't "incorporate" until Feb of 2001, according to the Administrators reports, and started in basically 1999/2000 - quite a bit different than I believed and thought at the time. Nothing wrong with it, just different info than I was told.

At any rate, I hope you won't have the issues that I was told revolved around the harness for a couple of the others. Looks like later cars had it okay as I've not heard anything about issues there.

I understand the wiring man changed somewhere in 2001/02, or something changes, and things got a little better sorted and organized, particularily for the kits. I don't think Hershal had any issues with his car and his came mid-2001, so things might have swapped around by then. I didn't know I had any issues until I'd heard about it from Herhsal RE: Dan's stuff, so maybe it wasn't a huge deal.

R

 

[DMatt]

Hey Guys,

Yes RF 44's harness that came with the car had some serious issues. Ron had not yet unwrapped the harness from its original packaging. As I looked over the instructions that came with the car and laid out the harness on my workbench it was apparent that something was not right. The harness did not match up to the schematic which Ron had neatly organized in a folder. At first I thought there were missing parts to the harness but after scratching my head for a week or so I called Herschel. He told me that my car and several others had their harnesses made by a different vendor, and those harnesses had some issues. He asked me to send the complete Harness and fuse panel to him and he would look at it and forward it to Oz if need be, which he ultimately did. It took about 4 months but I got a brand new harness and fuse panel and a new CD at no charge. This was only days before Ron posted the news about RF's demise. Anyway, I have not yet had time to see if this new harness is correct or not but I'm assuming it's ok.

 

[Ron Earp]

Dan, that wiring diagram not everyone got, and it might have been for a reason. I don't think it jived with later versions of the harness because I don't think anyone but me, Bob, and maybe one or two others got that stuff. I am sorry that it caused you such trouble. I didn't know about the problems with it either and thought it was good to go.

I'm pretty sure John S. ran into some of the same issues, so make sure yours is good and "running" before buttoning everything up Mark. You might be fine, but based on the fact your and my old car is only eight numbers apart, and we now know RF didn't necessarily follow consectutive chassis numbers with some skips in there every now and again, my guess is check everything closely.

 

[Mark Worthington]

Hmmm...

Well, maybe I should start by seeing if there's some more info out there. All I have in the way of documentation is a set of wiring diagrams, one for each harness, with a list of the different harnesses and a schematic diagram showing how they are hooked up to each other, but not their location. The build manual refers to instructions for the electrical system, but this is all I have. Does anyone else have more, like schematics, instructions or photos?

I've always figured this part of the build would be plug-n-play. I hope there are no major issues with the harness, because that could add a several months to my already long build.


Dan, what kind of problems did you have with your harness? Mis-wired circuits, or something more benign, like wire lengths not being correct?

 

[Ron Earp]

Mine docs had schematics etc. but nothing in the way of where the harness is and where it goes. I'm sure you can figure it out if you have a detailed look. I spent two days last Christmas doing a harness from scratch for a race car, but it did have all functional lights etc and a full 9 gauge setup. Got it done, worked perfectly the first time I plugged it in. But, it took the better part of two days at the kitchen table with a lot of wire and drawing, and of course, the obligatory beer.

More to the point and to save a couple of days at least, I think if I were you and building the car and found issues I'd simply get a Painless harness for the car stuff and deal with the engine harness as a separate piece that can be had from lots of folks, including vendors on this site like Thor, SmartTech, and others.

Ron

 

[HILLY]

Mark,
Check your Email.

 

[Ross Nicol]

Mark
Chris Fahey could be worth talking to.He is an auto elec and worked at RF for quite a long time,until a few months ago. He now runs his own business ( Prestige Auto Wiring ) in Mornington.Not far from the RF factory.

contact details - ph 0402 917 739

[email protected]


Ross

 

[Peter Olliviere]

Mark,
I have the missing section of the manual showing the locations and hookup for the harness, if you still need it email me and I will arrange to get it to you.

Peter

 

[Mark Worthington]

Thank you for your help, gentlemen. I have also contacted Hershal who is providing assistance. I now have an electronic copy of the RF wiring manual and a quick review of it shows that it will be most helpful - thanks. I have to check when I get home tonight, but I think the stuff I have differs significantly from the harnesses depicted in the wiring manual. I'm almost certain the color coding of the main harness wires is different than what I have, and I only have one of the patch harnesses (ignition switch patch). I need to assess what I have and see if I can make it work, but I will probably contact Mr. Fahey shortly.

Thanks

 

[DMatt]

Mark,

My harness had multiple problems. Some of the wire colors on the same plug did not match the schematic. I also had 4 or 5 plugs that did not match up to any other plugs I had. That is why I thought I had missing parts. Nothing I had matched up to the Smith instruments. I think that harness must have been incomplete and made for a different car. If you like, I will send you a copy of the CD they sent to me. That offer goes to anyone else who wants one as well.

 

[Mark Worthington]

Now I'm really confused. I spent tonight looking over my harness and reading the RF wiring instructions. One thing is certain: my harness pre-dates the harness depicted in the manual - the color coding of the wires is different, and my harness includes an Intermediate Harness, which appears to be included in the main harness on the newer cars.

So I went through the wiring diagrams I have for my harness and was able to label all the connectors on the dash and main harnesses. A few of the connectors had minor variations in color coding of the wires from what was shown in the diagrams I have, but most of it went OK. Then I checked the wire color codes at the three main connectors that feed the dash harness. One of the connectors had the wire colors match up perfectly with my wiring diagram. Another had one variance. The third connector (the white Molex one) did not match the wiring diagram for any single wire. I'm not sure if this means my harness is screwed but it doesn't leave me with a warm fuzzy feeling. I guess the only way to figure it out is to hook everything up and try it, although the thought of burning up my instrument panel isn't too appealing.

So the good news is I'm starting to get my head around this stuff, but the bad news is I still don't have a clue if my harness is good or not. I sent an email to Mr. Fahey but haven't heard back from him.

 

Sorry about the delay Mark, been working too much. Would it be any help if I were to scan the wiring instructions I received and made them available as a pdf? I'll also grab some pics and upload them tonight when I get home.

 

I have a bunch of pictures now, but as you noted in your earlier post, it is very tight in there and not sure how helpful they will be. I got my car after yours, and as I said, no problems. My harness comes through the main cabin and splits into a large loom going to the left side with the smaller part staying right. That then splits with another smaller loom going to the back of the car. I did splice in a power cable for the anti-feedback valve, can't remember where it came from though. I'll send you an email with my phone number if you want to discuss.

 

[Mark Worthington]

Thanks, Pat, but it sounds like you have the later version of the harness, and I already have those instructions.

I'm going to go ahead and give the harness I have a try. Everything seems to be there - hopefully it's right.

 

[DMatt]

Mark,

I found 10 photos I took of the harness I sent back to Hershal with some notes I made. You may be able to compare what I had to what you have. Don't know if it will help or not but I will send them to you if you wish. P/M me with your e-mail address.

 

[Mark Worthington]

Dan, I sent you a PM but I'm not sure it went through - seems the size of our PM boxes decreased with the new software and I was over the limit. Just in case you didn't get it, my email addy is:

mark dot worthington at gmail dot com