So sad.

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Pete McCluskey.

Lifetime Supporter
To see another 14 people lose their lives in a needless shooting.
My condolences to the families of those killed and injured.
 

Randy V

Admin
Lifetime Supporter
Just terrible.... A lot of questions left to be answered... Many will never be answered... My prayers for the families and victims...
 

Larry L.

Lifetime Supporter
...and, in addition to all the indescribable misery they've caused others, they orphaned their own little 6-month-old daughter as well.

Hollywood would be hard-pressed to conjure up two more evil scum bags.
 

Keith

Moderator
A new low. Apparently, the male was in a meeting with the subsequent victims, got into an argument and ran out. Did no more than drive home, change into combat fatigues, picked up his wife and weapons and returned with these tragic results. Sometimes there just does not seem enough logic in the world to try and understand what drives these kind of people...

It has to be a kind of mental illness, surely?
 
This appears to be a confluence of workplace violence and jihad, which is a first I think? Clearly it was not spontaneous, it was planned at least some point in advance. But it will be interesting to see if the prime motivation was workplace conflict or just ordinary Muslim terrorism that we see someplace in the world every day?
 

Keith

Moderator
There is nothing to indicate his religion and he was American born. His wife, on the other hand, he "acquired" in Saudi which seems a little strange and it is obviously odds on that she was of the Islamic faith. Whether this is significant or an unfortunate coincidence, I wonder if we're ever really know... As regards a possible "terrorist" attack, the Community Centre in question seems an odd choice of target.

I echo Larry's insightful comment re: the perpetrators making an orphan of their own child. So wrong.
 

Keith

Moderator
Congratulations Howard, you turned this matter into a political rant when others are showing their respects. Everything you have stated is pure rhetoric and brings nothing new to the table whatsoever and it is fairly certain that no radical Muslims are building SLC's at this time. You may well be correct as to the motivation but there is no information out there which confirms your viewpoint at this time. Personally, I am prepared to wait until the experts on scene investigate this matter further.


Howards post is deleted...See Paddock Sticky..
 
Howards post is deleted...See Paddock Sticky..
Your sticky appears to be gone...

Submitting to censorship is to enter the seductive world of 'The Giver': the world where there are no bad words and no bad deeds. But it is also the world where choice has been taken away and reality distorted. And that is the most dangerous world of all.

-Lois Lowry
 

Keith

Moderator
Not censorship Pat. Anyone can have any view they like and express it but there is a line and it gets crossed & trampled on quite often down here in the Paddock. The line is anything that might damage the reputation and work-ability of this site. If you think that I am in the wrong, please contact Ron and offer your views. If he thinks I'M wrong, then I will gracefully withdraw..

The sticky is on it's way back. Thanks for the heads-up.. :)
 
People are quick to believe that this attack was carried out by some deranged gun nuts, but when Arabic names and the possibility of an isolated Muslim attack come forward, it gets very quite.
 

Keith

Moderator
People are quick to believe that this attack was carried out by some deranged gun nuts, but when Arabic names and the possibility of an isolated Muslim attack come forward, it gets very quite.

Al, it's quiet because everyone is hoping that it isn't as you say. No other reason and no rush to judgement mate...

I believe that's what people are quite shit scared of and if this attack is thus then it comes close to home. I would say that no-one, not a single person has come up with any sure way of tackling domestic terrorism on this scale. and that's why I'm hoping there is another motivation behind it for all your and our sakes because there will be many many more if this proves to be a terrorist attack.
 

Brian Stewart
Such acts are, to me, so utterly senseless. Sympathies to all the victims.
 

Larry L.

Lifetime Supporter
Look. Those two sum bags O-B-V-I-O-U-S-L-Y were planning a terrorist attack. Whether or not it was prematurely 'triggered' by some argument at a party is neither here nor there.

Proof? THEY HAD PREVIOUSLY MADE AND S-T-O-R-E-D A NUMBER OF IEDs (who else but terrorists DO that?), they had bombs attached to R/C toy cars, the explosives and 'triggers' were similar to known ISIS designs, they had a stockpile of ammo, they had body armor. Combine that with the fact they had 2 "assault" rifles and two 9mm pistols (which is all we KNOW they had right now), and the fact they were both 'devout' Muslims..and what does LOGIC tell you given what passes for 'reality' in today's world?

To believe for even a nanosecond that this incident might be ANYTHING BUT a terrorist attack is the same as looking at a frozen lake in the dead of winter and believing the weather might not be subfreezing.
 
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Keith

Moderator
You have more information than we do Larry and it certainly looks as if you are quite correct from what you have posted.

I have no words really except we must put out heads down and find solutions which stop short of stripping ourselves of our humanity.
 

Keith

Moderator
What's intriguing is that it is being suggested (on TV new just now) that this perhaps wasn't the original intended target but something ticked him off and he went into action. I do believe the discovery of many other pipe bombs and bomb making equipment puts it beyond doubt.. Your own White House is advising 'caution' but that's only to be expected. They're going to have to 'fess up at some stage though..The wife apparently had a Pakistan passport so that makes meeting her in Saudi more than a bit dubious anyway.

He (a restaurant inspector) is being described as 'mild' by his ex colleagues.
 

Pete McCluskey.

Lifetime Supporter
No doubt they were devout Islams and no doubt they were planning something because of what has been found in their home. Interesting that one neighbour said their were strange comings and goings late at night but she said nothing for fear of being labelled a racist.
P.C. At work?
 

Jeff Young

GT40s Supporter
It appears Pete is correct. Yet another sad tale of a young Muslim -- this one loved cars and apparently worked on vintage and performance cars in his garage with his friends (unfortunately the same one he made bombs) like many of us -- who became radicalized for reasons unknown.

It is odd that something at a holiday party set him off, something that clearly wasn't planned. To clarify, they were certainly armed and it is a reasonable inference to think they were planning SOMETHING..but this, attacking a social services center after a dispute at a party is strange.

Two religious based shootings in the US in a week. Sad all around.
 
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