GT40s.com Paddock Politics Thread

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Keith

Moderator
Hmm same old circular conversation. To be fair though, I see that much of the vitriol displayed here is being repeated generally on the internet.

Is the internet to blame for this hate? Or a lack of self discipline?

After all, everyone knows no-one is going to change anyone's opinion by ranting and cursing at them. So why bother? It seems idiotic to me.

How would you guys react to each other face to face? Is polite conversation with politics the subject matter now impossible in the USA? Indeed is any polite conversation possible on the internet?

I seems to me that battle lines are being drawn.

This could turn ugly.

Better stock up on ammo.
 

Larry L.

Lifetime Supporter
Sounds like another gun nutter who thinks the present situation is acceptable.

Fortunately, that type of person is in an increasing minority in this country.

A shame though for the responsible gun owners in this country, who are going to see their rights limited because a bunch of recalcitrant nutjobs think it is ok to see kids get shot in schools because "I like guns!"


Oooooookaaay...here's my challenge to you and anyone else who's of the opinion that "more gun laws" will put an end gun crime/gun violence/gun deaths:

Given the fact we already HAVE a bazillion gun laws currently on the books...NONE OF WHICH either individually or collectively prevented Sandy Hook, Orlando, San Bernardino, Columbine, V.T., Parkland or you name the mass shooting (including the outright gun BAN known as the "gun-FREE zone" law): give us the EXACT wording of THEE new gun law the consequences of violating which would be so horrific...so catastrophic...so terrifying...so trauma-inducing in the hearts and minds of crooks and loons that they would never even DARE THINK ABOUT violating same let alone actually VIOLATE it...and 'would thereby end all gun crime forever.

If you CANNOT come up with a gun law that would accomplish that (and no one ever has), then for the love of Pete admit no such gun law CAN be written...ADMIT that loons and crooks will continue to what they do no matter how many "laws" are passed...and shuddup about "more gun laws!", "more gun laws!", "more gun laws!"

If you can do NEITHER, then 'splain' to me how further unconstitutionally restricting the gun R-I-G-H-T-S of law abiding people in-and-of-itself will somehow mystically & magically change the behavior of crooks and loons where none of the gun laws we currently have on the books has ever been able to do so.

And please refrain from regurgitating the left's 'fall back' position, "If new laws save just ONE LIFE, blah, blah, blah." They WON'T. If history has proven anything it's proven that.
 

Randy V

Moderator-Admin
Staff member
Admin
Lifetime Supporter
14 Walter.. Big enough to have earned the nickname in High School back in the 60’s
 
Oooooookaaay...here's my challenge to you and anyone else who's of the opinion that "more gun laws" will put an end gun crime/gun violence/gun deaths:

Given the fact we already HAVE a bazillion gun laws currently on the books...NONE OF WHICH either individually or collectively prevented Sandy Hook, Orlando, San Bernardino, Columbine, V.T., Parkland or you name the mass shooting (including the outright gun BAN known as the "gun-FREE zone" law): give us the EXACT wording of THEE new gun law the consequences of violating which would be so horrific...so catastrophic...so terrifying...so trauma-inducing in the hearts and minds of crooks and loons that they would never even DARE THINK ABOUT violating same let alone actually VIOLATE it...and 'would thereby end all gun crime forever.

If you CANNOT come up with a gun law that would accomplish that (and no one ever has), then for the love of Pete admit no such gun law CAN be written...ADMIT that loons and crooks will continue to what they do no matter how many "laws" are passed...and shuddup about "more gun laws!", "more gun laws!", "more gun laws!"

If you can do NEITHER, then 'splain' to me how further unconstitutionally restricting the gun R-I-G-H-T-S of law abiding people in-and-of-itself will somehow mystically & magically change the behavior of crooks and loons where none of the gun laws we currently have on the books has ever been able to do so.

And please refrain from regurgitating the left's 'fall back' position, "If new laws save just ONE LIFE, blah, blah, blah." They WON'T. If history has proven anything it's proven that.

Australia. Bah dum. (mike drop)
 

Larry L.

Lifetime Supporter
This should hopefully help explain it for you. Keith posted the video back on page 122:

Jim Jefferies on gun control full version on Vimeo


You'll have to do better than that. 'Made it to 03:15 and got tired of the blather.

My CHALLENGE was (in short) to give me the EXACT WORDING of a gun law that would end gun violence. O-B-V-I-O-U-S-L-Y you couldn't come up with one...so, you chose instead to substitute some Australian's an anti-gun comedy routine in place of same. 'Doesn't cut it.

So, care to try again? Oh, and BTW, remember this is the U.S.A. Make sure your proposal COMPLIES WITH OUR SECOND AMENDMENT. Don't be proposing mandatory gun confiscation or any crap like that. (It wouldn't prevent all gun crimes/deaths anyway even if it COULD be imposed.)

Obviously you 'dropped the MIC' waaaaay too soon.
 
I find it amazing that I posted a report about Opioid abuse/deaths that has twice the total death rate and rising and far more school age deaths than firearms and no one said a word. Overdose Death Rates | National Institute on Drug Abuse (NIDA)
I guess firearms related dead are more dead than opioid related dead.

Al, you have made several similar posts over time, I said some words, and you did not like the words. No point saying the same words, you have obviously made up your mind, whatever I or anyone else you do not agree with says is not going to change it.

Oooooookaaay...here's my challenge to you and anyone else who's of the opinion that "more gun laws" will put an end gun crime/gun violence/gun deaths:
Given the fact we already HAVE a bazillion gun laws currently on the books...NONE OF WHICH either individually or collectively prevented Sandy Hook, Orlando, San Bernardino, Columbine, V.T., Parkland or you name the mass shooting (including the outright gun BAN known as the "gun-FREE zone" law): give us the EXACT wording of THEE new gun law the consequences of violating which would be so horrific...so catastrophic...so terrifying...so trauma-inducing in the hearts and minds of crooks and loons that they would never even DARE THINK ABOUT violating same let alone actually VIOLATE it...and 'would thereby end all gun crime forever.

If you CANNOT come up with a gun law that would accomplish that (and no one ever has), then for the love of Pete admit no such gun law CAN be written...ADMIT that loons and crooks will continue to what they do no matter how many "laws" are passed...and shuddup about "more gun laws!", "more gun laws!", "more gun laws!"

If you can do NEITHER, then 'splain' to me how further unconstitutionally restricting the gun R-I-G-H-T-S of law abiding people in-and-of-itself will somehow mystically & magically change the behavior of crooks and loons where none of the gun laws we currently have on the books has ever been able to do so.

And please refrain from regurgitating the left's 'fall back' position, "If new laws save just ONE LIFE, blah, blah, blah." They WON'T. If history has proven anything it's proven that.

Larry, you have posted this before I gave you a law, you did not like my law, No point posting the same law you have obviously made up your mind, whatever I say or anyone else you do not agree with says is not going to change it.

In the UK following a mass shooting in 1996 at a school, both sides of the political spectrum united, and the left supported a right wing conservative government in implementing tougher gun control laws.
 
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Larry L.

Lifetime Supporter
Larry, you have posted this before I gave you a law, you did not like my law, No point posting the same law you have obviously made up your mind, whatever I say or anyone else you do not agree with says is not going to change it.


Please REPOST that law. I don't recall ever having seen your post on same.

If I DID see it and I DIDN'T "like (your) law", you can bet the prime reason for that was it didn't/doesn't pass muster regarding the U.S. Constitution...and that was likely just for starters.

So - please repost.
 
Please REPOST that law. I don't recall ever having seen your post on same.

If I DID see it and I DIDN'T "like (your) law", you can bet the prime reason for that was it didn't/doesn't pass muster regarding the U.S. Constitution...and that was likely just for starters.

So - please repost.

You must have forgotten, you replied several times to my posts so you must have seen them. As I said no point reposting, you have made up your mind.

Question on US politics forum can the Constitution be amended.

Answer Yes, the constitution can be amended. In fact the second amendment is just that: an amendment. You can continue to add new amendments, even on existing amendments.

This has actually already happened. The 18th amendment established Prohibition. After a short time the 18th amendment was repealed by the 21st amendment. So it is entirely possible to create a new amendment that says.....

The process for this is defined by Article V of the constitution.

The Congress, whenever two thirds of both Houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose Amendments to this Constitution, or, on the Application of the Legislatures of two thirds of the several States, shall call a Convention for proposing Amendments, which, in either Case, shall be valid to all Intents and Purposes, as Part of this Constitution, when ratified by the Legislatures of three fourths of the several States, or by Conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other Mode of Ratification may be proposed by the Congress; Provided that no Amendment which may be made prior to the Year One thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any Manner affect the first and fourth Clauses in the Ninth Section of the first Article; and that no State, without its Consent, shall be deprived of its equal Suffrage in the Senate.

In simple terms if 2/3rds of the Senate and Congress (or 2/3rds of the states) agree then they can propose an amendment. That amendment would then have to be ratified by 75% of the state legislatures. Then the proposal becomes an amendment to the US Constitution.
 
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You'll have to do better than that. 'Made it to 03:15 and got tired of the blather.

My CHALLENGE was (in short) to give me the EXACT WORDING of a gun law that would end gun violence. O-B-V-I-O-U-S-L-Y you couldn't come up with one...so, you chose instead to substitute some Australian's an anti-gun comedy routine in place of same. 'Doesn't cut it.

So, care to try again? Oh, and BTW, remember this is the U.S.A. Make sure your proposal COMPLIES WITH OUR SECOND AMENDMENT. Don't be proposing mandatory gun confiscation or any crap like that. (It wouldn't prevent all gun crimes/deaths anyway even if it COULD be imposed.)

Obviously you 'dropped the MIC' waaaaay too soon.

Quite easy, just Google Australian gun laws. Gun violence way down.

Slavery was part of the Constitution. And abolished with the 13th Amendment.

Bah dum. Mic drop!
 
It can't be the deaths that bothers you because hundreds of thousands die by the means I mentioned before, and the gun homicides are trivial in amount by comparison. Death doesn't bother you, so it must control, as in firearms control. You Liberals are into control.
 
It can't be the deaths that bothers you because hundreds of thousands die by the means I mentioned before, and the gun homicides are trivial in amount by comparison. Death doesn't bother you, so it must control, as in firearms control. You Liberals are into control.

Round and round we go.

It is actually you who appear to not be bothered by shootings in you schools, or other murders by guns, they make up part of the gun homicides that according to you " are trivial in amount by comparison"...really?

Al I think you recently posted a list of the what caused your hundreds and thousands of deaths, I can't seem to find it now but four on the list that I remember were heart disease, overdose of drugs, deaths caused by cars, and deaths caused by medical negligence.

Although tragic, most of these deaths were self inflicted, and in the case of medical negligence, and deaths by cars not a deliberate act inflicted on someone else. Below is a list of shootings in your schools in the US in 2018 up to February this year i.e. 2 months. You may feel they are trivial. i and many others don't.

Please show me where an individual has gone into a school or any other place for that matter, and committed the deliberate premeditated mass murder and deaths or injury of innocent children or members of the public by using.

Heart disease.
Drugs overdose.
A car.
Medical negligence

On January 22, shots were fired from a truck in the car park of NET Charter High School in New Orleans, Louisiana, targeting students during their lunch break. One student was injured during the incident.
On the same date, a 16-year-old male fired at his 15-year-old classmate in the cafeteria of Italy High School, Texas. The young victim was wounded while cops quickly apprehended the teen shooter.
On January 23, a 15-year-old male student shot 16 people in the lobby at Marshall County High School in Benton, Kentucky, killing two 15-year-olds. One died at the scene and the other passed away from wounds in hospital.
On February 1, two 15-year-old students were shot and injured inside a classroom at Sal Castro Middle School in Los Angeles, California. A 12-year-old girl was arrested.
On February 14, a gunman stormed Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland, Florida, killing at least 17 people and injuring up to 50. Parkland police arrested former pupil Nikolas Cruz, 19, who was expelled from the school in 2017.
On March 7, a 17-year-old girl was shot dead and a 17-year-old boy injured in a gun incident at Huffman High School in Birminham, Alabama.
 
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Larry L.

Lifetime Supporter
You must have forgotten, you replied several times to my posts so you must have seen them. As I said no point reposting, you have made up your mind.

Question on US politics forum can the Constitution be amended.

Answer Yes, the constitution can be amended. In fact the second amendment is just that: an amendment. You can continue to add new amendments, even on existing amendments.

This has actually already happened. The 18th amendment established Prohibition. After a short time the 18th amendment was repealed by the 21st amendment. So it is entirely possible to create a new amendment that says.....

The process for this is defined by Article V of the constitution.

The Congress, whenever two thirds of both Houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose Amendments to this Constitution, or, on the Application of the Legislatures of two thirds of the several States, shall call a Convention for proposing Amendments, which, in either Case, shall be valid to all Intents and Purposes, as Part of this Constitution, when ratified by the Legislatures of three fourths of the several States, or by Conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other Mode of Ratification may be proposed by the Congress; Provided that no Amendment which may be made prior to the Year One thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any Manner affect the first and fourth Clauses in the Ninth Section of the first Article; and that no State, without its Consent, shall be deprived of its equal Suffrage in the Senate.

In simple terms if 2/3rds of the Senate and Congress (or 2/3rds of the states) agree then they can propose an amendment. That amendment would then have to be ratified by 75% of the state legislatures. Then the proposal becomes an amendment to the US Constitution.



What does any of the above have to do with you providing the text of the gun law you said you've previously posted??? "As I said no point reposting, you have made up your mind" is simply a CYA statement in place of providing a link to the law or to the post in which you said you quoted it.

I know all about the amendment process. That has nothing to do with what we're supposedly addressing. That info is simply obfuscation and redirection. So, I'm left with the impression that the 'mystery gun law' to which you've referred will remain just that...if it exists at all.
 
What does any of the above have to do with you providing the text of the gun law you said you've previously posted??? "As I said no point reposting, you have made up your mind" is simply a CYA statement in place of providing a link to the law or to the post in which you said you quoted it.

I know all about the amendment process. That has nothing to do with what we're supposedly addressing. That info is simply obfuscation and redirection. So, I'm left with the impression that the 'mystery gun law' to which you've referred will remain just that...if it exists at all.

As I understand it not at all Larry you keep saying the laws, mine included, cannot be implemented because of the 2nd amendment. I and others on the outside looking in say they can because you can amend the 2nd amendment, it has been done before or was allowing drinking alcohol again more important, than trying to stop your citizens and children being shot?

No time to search for it now I am afraid, off to France with my son and his friends to watch a rugby league match on Saturday, far more enjoyable than this rubbish. If you search back you will find my law and your usual retort about it not being compliant with the 2nd amendment, which as explained above can be amended if you have the will to do so, but that fact is allegedly irrelevant and obfuscation and redirection, another favorite retort of yours.
 
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Larry L.

Lifetime Supporter
Quite easy, just Google Australian gun laws. Gun violence way down.

Slavery was part of the Constitution. And abolished with the 13th Amendment.

Bah dum. Mic drop!




I'll go along with the "dum" part.

If it's "quite easy" as you claim, it should be no problem for you to provide a link to the specific Aussie gun law that specifically addresses my challenge. I'm not ABOUT to sift thru the myriad of Australian gun laws LOOKING FOR what you claim exists!

"Gun violence way down" is NOT "gun violence has ceased", is it. Reread my challenge. Further, if you're referring to the Aussie gun confiscation law - THAT would be absolutely unconstitutional here in the U.S. and would therefore be null and void upon its signing...and besides, that action didn't E-N-D gun violence "down under", did it. No law ever will...which, as you well know, has been my point all along.

Even repealing the 2nd Amend, which you and Nick seem to be insisting/suggesting will meet my OP challenge above, would NOT end gun violence. Remember prohibition? Nick brought that up. Did THAT end the production, sale and consumption of booze???! Similarly, repealing the 2nd Amend would NOT end either gun ownership, concealed carry, or all the various gun crimes.

Now, would you care to try to directly address my original challenge?

"Mic drop" my eye...
 

Larry L.

Lifetime Supporter
...No time to search for it now I am afraid...

Uuuuuuh huh...but evidentially I automatically do have the time...right?


...you keep saying the laws, mine included, cannot be implemented because of the 2nd amendment.

BINGO! You're beginning to 'get it'. That pesky lil' ole constitution says "no law INFRINGING" on the R-I-G-H-T to keep and bear. So, from what you just stated, I take it I indeed would discover that "your law"...the one you either can't or haven't the time to find...is in fact unconstitutional.

...If you search back you will find my law and your usual retort about it not being compliant with the 2nd amendment, which as explained above can be amended if you have the will to do so, but that fact is allegedly irrelevant and obfuscation and redirection, another favorite retort of yours.

IOW, you CANNOT give me the wording of THEE gun law that would end gun crime...which is exactly what I claimed would be the case.

Incidentally, repealing the 2nd Amend wouldn't end gun crime anymore than Prohibition ended the production, sale and consumption of booze as I stated above.
 
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