New 3.22.1 Audi 016 Crown Wheel & Pinions available

[Peter Delaney]

Welcome back Oliver (oops, I mean Mitch D, or maybe its Dick Cheney) :

'if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it's probably a duck.'

Shoot first, think later - not a good policy !

I am pretty sure that I contacted the same gear manufacturer here in OZ regarding a higher ratio R&P for my G50 - price was A$2750 - suspiciously like the price for the Audi unit !

However, being a complete neophyte in terms of the "sue or be sued" mentality, I simply found a local manufacturer who said they could supply the R&P - I obviously should have asked about who paid for the design, who owned the "patent", will I get sued, will I be insulted on the GT40 Forum, etc !!

Luckily, I decided against this upgrade - so the worst that can happen to me is to be sued by someone for "intent to think about maybe using a product which was offered to me in good faith, but not checking the details of its design origins" - Baahh & Humbug !!!

I posted details of the G50 R&P option that I found ages ago, no dramas from who-ever paid for the design of that one. I am sure that Mick just did the same thing - publicised something in good faith that might be of interest to other Forum members. And for this, he cops all the cr*p ?

Mitch, chill out mate - its all not worth the angst.

PS : An apolgy for the following "Oliver-like" statement is seriously in order :

"I am saying in very clear terms that I believe you are a crook and you're attempting to sell goods for which you don't have the authority to obtain."

Rude at best.

Kind Regards,

Peter D.

 

[ QUOTE ]
A conversation was held with the vendor today.

[/ QUOTE ]
How so?

Strange- as Mick has stated, we here in Au have been unable to contact the vender today via phone, as “the boss is away today”.

[ QUOTE ]
GTA has an agreement with the vendor, it's not between me and the vendor. Suffice to say, the parties involved in that agreement will hash it out.

[/ QUOTE ]
Which is the way it should be?
This still doesn’t excuse your defamation by assumption.
[ QUOTE ]
As for my comments about Mick, 'if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it's probably a duck.'

[/ QUOTE ]
There you go again, defaming by assumption because YOU THINK he’s a duck. Since when has it been legal to defame someone because YOU think it’s probable?
[ QUOTE ]
I am the originating party that funded design and development, and the pic on Mick's dubious site is the unit which I own and it's currently installed in a car here in the states. I have been very forthcoming on this forum about all stages of development from the kick-off.

Mick on the other hand has never uttered a word about an R&P prior to now, and it's quite apparent he isn't forthcoming to any potential customers about the nature of the item, it's uniqueness with regards to install in the Audi trans, his experience with design and development with the vendor, etc.

[/ QUOTE ]
Has anybody said anything to the contrary?
As it states on front page of Micks “Dubious” website - “You may also ask any questions you like in our forums regarding the construction processes of various GT40's”.
Did you bother to contact Mick yourself before making your ridiculous accusations?
[ QUOTE ]
You also appear to be involved with Mick. I notice your homepage is also the same as Mick's.

[/ QUOTE ]
Wow, you’re quite the net detective aren’t you? You seem to enjoy implied suspicions at every turn?
It’s a pity that no one was trying to hide anything in this case…sorry.
What is your point anyway?
Anyone who knows Mick can’t comment?!
FYI I am his brother, AND the guy who’s helping him build his “ DUBIOUS” website as you so eloquently put it..
Does that alter the fact that you feel you have the right to defame someone over assumed “probability”?
All of this without even doing any research, or even speaking to your accused?
[ QUOTE ]
My challenge is simple to you or Mick - stand and deliver one of those R&P's. If you do, then I'll stand down.

Mitch D

PS - if Mick or you are "resellers" then you're not supposed to be using this forum as "members". You're supposed to pay as a manufacturer/vendor if that is the case.

[/ QUOTE ]

How is what Mick is trying to do any different to what you have tried and failed to do? –get an order for 10 units for the vendor.

If these are the criteria for being a reseller, then you are also a reseller...no?

I think the real gripe you have here is that Mick has actually managed to make it happen and you aren’t receiving your beloved praise..correct?

How dare he!

Bad Mick…you “underhanded crook with a dubious website” you.

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dead_horse.gif

 

[Mike Dozier]

Mitch

I suspect most of the membership appreciate the efforts
you made with GTA to pursue this tranny mod. And your concerns about the difficulty in making the modification
are well documented. However I am uncomfortable
with the accusatons you have made of Mick without having
all the facts. Being a citizen of the US you enjoy the benefit of being presumed innocent until proven guilty, and I would hope most Americans follow that philosophy.

I don't know Mick "from a bar of soap" either...however
I think we owe him the courtesy of providing his side
before rushing to judgement.

If GTA has an exclusivity agreement with the gear maker,
and they are in violation (or threatening to be), then
the principals involved should work it out, and provide
the facts to their customers. Litigation usually only benefits lawyers.

MikeD

 

[Mitch D]

My behaviour on the forum has been awful, so please bear with me while I write this brief mea culpa and then impose self-exile from further posts for the forseeable future.

First - I sincerly apologize to Mick and Andrew. I don't know these gentlemen and it was wrong for me to lash out and blame them for what appears to be a breakdown of agreements somewhere along the line.

Second - Please note that the opinions stated in the above thread are mine alone, they do not represent any views of GTA (or John at GTA), the gear vendor, etc.

Third - Anyone that already has placed an order with GTA should rest assured that your R&P is in the works. GTA has already placed the first production batch order with the vendor as of a few weeks ago. The goods are being produced and I believe you'll find GTA to be completely professional and they will deliver finished,rebuilt transaxles to your satisfaction. That is what they did for me, their customer.

I have no excuses. I can only say that when I embarked on the project to develop the R&P it was because none were available anywhere at any price. My primary goal was to have a trans for my own project, if anyone else could also use the final product then that was just gravy. As I stated, I'm not selling these items and make absolutely no money from any unit sold. It's been a long road to complete something that I originally considered fairly non-complex. I can't imagine what it's like to build the entire GT as we see RF, CAV, and other builders/manufacturers doing successfully.

Again - my apologies for my ridiculous behaviour. If anyone has any questions, please PM me or email me directly since I will endeavour to not post until I feel I can offer something of value to others. My posts in the above thread certainly do not add value to anyone.

Regards,
Mitch D

 

[Peter Olliviere]

Mitch,

Self exile is not expected of you. I have followed what you were doing with interest as would anyone that is running an 016. I don't support your reaction but I can understand it. With that said in my opinion your last post was the stand up thing to do untill and if facts prove otherwise but going away is not.

Peter

 

[Mark Worthington]

Re: New 3.22.1 Audi 016 Crown Wheel & Pinions available

*** throws out empty popcorn container ***

No worries, Mitch...you don't need to exile yourself. You obviously have pride of ownership with respect to the improved R&P, as you rightly should, since YOU were the one who took the initiative last year on the matter. Or was it two years ago?

One thing I've learned about the GT40 "industry" is that good ideas often get copied and put to good use, but often times the people who drive innovation don't get the proper credit. There are some vendors who, in my opinion, are overly sensitive to the possibility that others could copy their ideas. There are others who I know to have blatently stolen other people's ideas, body moulds, designs, etc. and attempted to take full credit for the idea, or at least who have not provided what I would consider to be proper acknowledgement of the source of their ideas or products. There are still others who will say "Hey, look what I did, it worked great for me and maybe you all can benefit!" Fortunately, the latter types of people comprise the majority on this forum, and I think that Mick's posting of his turkey pan drawings most likely puts him into this category. That's what this forum is really about, sharing experiences, ideas and tips on building and maintaining our dream cars.

Another thing I've learned about this industry is that nobody is going to get rich offering products or services geared towards GT40s. A few will make a decent living at it and truly love their jobs, most will cover their costs, but nobody's getting rich. The market is simply too small.

 

[JCoop]

>>With that said in my opinion your last post was the stand up thing to do untill and if facts prove otherwise but going away is not.<<


I agree...self exile allowed only to the garage to finish your build.

 

[Pete McCluskey.]

Mitch although I was critical of you, I don't see any need at all for you to exile yourself. You have done the right thing and apologised to Mick. End of the section. Let's all go back to enjoying the Forum. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif

 

[Mick]

Subject is now closed and forgotten, dont go anyware Mitch. I do appriciate your fellings in this matter, perhaps it got a bit personal, I still prefer the old fashioned punch up, shake hands after and have beer afterwards. I aploogize for any adverse comments.

 

[Mick]

Re: New 3.22.1 Audi 016 Crown Wheel & Pinions available

Mitch we need and apriciate passionate innovative people which you are obviously one of. I expect we will all look forward to any new ideas.

 

[Dan W]

[ QUOTE ]
Welcome back Oliver (oops, I mean Mitch D, or maybe its Dick Cheney) :



[/ QUOTE ]
I like Dick Cheney even if he made a huge mistake with his rifle. Cant we all just get along /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Peter Delaney]

Sorry Dan, that was a little out of line (but at the time, I thought it was just too good an analogy (re Mitch's ducks) to miss) ! You know most of us Aussies have a most irreverent sense of humour when it comes to politicians !

Mitch, you are a true gentleman & I apologise for being rude to you. We all get a bit hot under the collar from time to time, so Mick's suggestion of a punch-up, shake hands, & then a beer or 4 is the go !!

Maybe this is a good idea for the United Nations - boxing gloves & cartons of beer hanging from the walls at 6ft intervals !!

Don't do the exile thing - not at all required and not at all expected - we all would be the losers on that one.

Kind Regards,

Peter D.

 

[Rick Muck- Mark IV]

Re: New 3.22.1 Audi 016 Crown Wheel & Pinions available

Taking no sides in this matter I do understand what may have happened, I have been a "victim" of this sort of industrial misdeed. Yeras ago I was having some parts made in Taiwan via a broker. I paid for the tooling and owned said tools. I requested a "witness mark", basically a small "flaw" be engraved in the tool to produce a mark that was on the unseen side of the part. After having bought the tooling and having several thousand pieces produced, I discovered another vendor selling the same part as I did. Not unusual as several items in the reproduction market are often done by different companies. It was at a car meet when I picked up one of the parts on another dealers table and looked at it that I discovered the "witness mark" on his piece. I asked him where he had bought it and he told me a distributor that I was familiar with. Just to double check, I called the distributor and bought a couple....all had my ID on them. I then called the distributor and asked him where he got them, he told me he had been contacted by a manufacturer in Taiwan and offered the parts to purchase...FOR LESS THAN I WAS PAYING FOR THEM!! and with NO tooling costs!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beat.gif I learned that in the far East agreements and trademark/patent/ownership rights are mere formalities and to have my tooling removed from the manufacturer and stored when not in use.

this may be a similar situation, I do understand both sides of the story and hope it works out well for all....

Rick /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif

 

[Howard Jones]

Mitch, Mick, You guys like GT40's right? Good enough for me. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif

 

[Mesa]

[/ QUOTE ] I like Dick Cheney even if he made a huge mistake with his rifle. Cant we all just get along /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Dick Cheney couldnt hit the side of his worst enemy with a RIFLE, that man needs a SHOTGUN with a big fan spread to even come close to acidentally killing someone (and he screwed that up too) /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif