Wilwood brakes

[Sam McDowell]

Help, again for the rookie.
My GTD was Wilwood calipers on the back. Four piston, two inboard & two outboard. I found that they have 4 bleed nipples, the outboards can not be bled with the wheels on. The calipers are mounted horizonal.
I have replaced the master cylinder and made sure all the pistons move freely. I have bled all eight valves 'til there are no bubbles. Yet I still have a soft peddle that has way too much travel.
It has a Tilton bias adjuster. The hose from the chasis to the caliper are steele mesh.
The front master has a short travel & is hard.
Any ideas?

 

[Rick Muck- Mark IV]

Are the bleeders on top or on the bottom? You may need to flip the calipers side to side.

 

[Howard Jones]

Ya...unbolt the rear caliper that is farthest from the master from it's mount but leave the brake fluid line on and tight. Orient the caliper so that the bleed fitting you are working on is pointed UP. Put a piece of wood in the caliper and between the pads to replace the rotor and bleed the caliper like this for each (both) bleed fitting on that end.

Then flip it over for the other two. You may be able to leave the caliper on the mount for one half of this and use the rotor instead of the wood block if you know what I mean. In any case all the bleed ports must be the highest point on the caliper when it is in use. This works best when the port (fitting) is facing straight up

When you are done with all four nipples on that caliper put it back on it's mount with the pads in it and back on it's rotor. Now do the other one the same way.

Now you have forced all the air to the highest point in the rear system on each side, up and out of the bleed ports. This method will leave no place for the air to hide.

There are a lot of ways to bleed brakes but this works for me.

 

[Frank Catt]

Another trick - follow Howards advice above ( you only need bleed the top nipples ) at the same time gently tapping the caliper with a wooden handle or soft block, this detaches any bubbles from the inside of the caliper while bleeding out. Frank

 

[David in Durango]

Howard and Frank have it. Don't think the air will bleed of the calipers are "horizontal".

Just a guess.

 

[Sam McDowell]

:thumbsup: Thanx
I am begining to think you guys know what you are talking about.
It is a pain in the arse but I took both calipers loose, pulled the pads out and wrangled them out. I was then able to point the nipples up and get more bubbles out. My wife is now type rated in brake bleeding assistant.
They are much much tighter but not rock hard. Could the braided brake line make it spongy?

 

[David in Durango]

No, the stainless braid is supposed to take the sponge out (vs. rubber).

Wilwood says to bleed the outside first (don't know how that could matter, but I followed the directions).

give the SWMBO [1] acting as assistant some extra "hugs" or something.

Good luck!

[1] She Who Must Be Obeyed

 

[Jack]

From the Hammer Films Production of SHE (1965) starring Ursula Andress FYI.

 

[Howard Jones]

Sam, only you can feel the firmness, or lack of, your brakes. The key is however, do they get better when you attempt to pump them up? If they do pump up (increase firmness with repeated pumping) then you still have air in the system.

You just need to keep at it until there is no air in the system. No compromise on this, sorry.

Frank is correct, in theory, you should be able to bleed from only the top two nipples but I find that when the calipers are new, dry, and have never been completely filled with oil, the four nipple bleed works better. Once they have been filled completely with oil then subsequent bleed jobs will be easier.

There have been many a worn out wife's leg bleeding brakes. Welcome her to the obsession for us!

 

[flatchat(Chris)]

If the master reservoir is lower than the calipers you may need a residual valve (in line) --- to compensate for drain back --just a thought for the job at hand.

(Sam)you mention :- pain in the arse, loose, pads out, nipples, bubbles, bleeding and wife-- whats a bloke to think ?

 

[Randy V]

X2 on the 2# residual valve....

Also - I've found that many calipers need "Shock Treatment" to knock tiny air-bubbles loose from the passage-ways and caliper cavities... Lightly tap on the mounting bolts with a small hammer or even a wrench will do.. Wait a few minutes and then bleed that caliper again..

 

[flatchat(Chris)]

I use a vacuum device for a one man brake bleed -- no probs so far

 

[David in Durango]

NO, two tries at marriage . . . .

David, would still like a try at Ms Andress!

From the Hammer Films Production of SHE (1965) starring Ursula Andress FYI.

 

[Jim Rosenthal]

What about a pressure bleeder- would that help him out?

 

[EGLITOM]

Dear Sam

RCR´s having also the 4 pistons wilwoods installed in the rear. THey are installed with the nipples to the top, so check if you can swap yours from left to right hand side and vise versa ( should be a easy fix to have the nipples showing up and thus no need for unbolting them for bleeding).
I also used a manual vacuum bleeder ( MIGHTYVAC). it is cheap and works very well.
With this we bled the outside nipple first than the inside one. On a RCR both lines have the same lenght, but if you have one longer than the other, start with the longer side.
The mighty vac has a overflow cup. if you fill this overflow cup app 30%,the hose coming from the caliper will be submerged in brake fluid. The advantage of this is you dont need to open and close the nipple during bleeding, because if it sucks back, it will suck brake fluid no air.
So the action would be: Apply the vacuum, open the bleed nipple and than supporting the bleed action by slowly pumping the pedal. Also make sure that the feed line to your master is air free ( if they run in circles from the master to the reservoir it could be air trapped there. Wilwood masters can be bleed as well. Do this before you bleed the calipers.

This worked well for us, and my son had bled all four corners within one hour. Pressurepoint is hard as rock. I could even go done one size on the masters to get a longer way and a little more feeling. Will wait for the first racetrack action to decide on that.

About the stainless braided lines, make shure that they are tefon hoses which are braided, not rubber hoses.

TOM