GT40s.com Paddock Politics Thread

[Pat]

There’s a generation of kids growing up with Columbine, Sandy Hook, Parkland, Orlando, etc. and I can only hope they enact strict gun control measures across the country. Baby Boomers, Generation X, Y and Z are just lost. Other developed countries just don’t have the problems we have here. There’s a lot of things we can do, but won’t get done until the kids become adults and vote NRA backed candidates out of office.

I’m so happy to live in CA, it’s not perfect, but I feel safe here without a gun. The NRA sucks.

Another selected study from Denmark? Blame Obama? Seriously? I can’t fight that kind of “logic.” Birth control pills? That some funny $hit.

Mocking suicide rates for women??? Who else thinks that's "funny $hit"?

But as I read it Rod, your plan so far, is to wait for five "lost" generations of to die off or are otherwise out of office. Brilliant!!! Then what???
You said there are other things we could do. So please tell us what they are.
What exactly do your "strict measures" look like?
Why haven't they been enacted in the your Democratic Party controlled state or your very liberal but crime ridden city?
What are those laws you'd pass once the NRA fascists are out of the way?
How would those laws be more effective than the laws against murder, assault, rape on the books now?
What's your plan that would prevent future Sandy Hook, Orlando, Las Vegas, and Parkland?
What's your plan to stop future California school shootings such as the ones in the North Park Elementary School in San Bernardino, Rancho Tehama, and the University of California, Santa Barbara? In the latter, the shooter, after promising a "day of retribution" on YouTube, went on a killing spree killing six and wounding thirteen. (sound familiar?)
Speaking of San Bernadino, what's your plan to stop someone like Mr. and Mrs. Farook who on December 2, 2015, killed 14 people and wounded 22 others in a mass shooting and an attempted bombing at the Inland Regional Center.
Why didn't the laws in the "safe" worker's paradise of California stop all that?

As an aside, with your statistical acumen, perhaps you can shed light as to why city-crime.come rates San Francisco crime worse than 92.7% of all U.S. cities.

Crime in San Francisco, California (CA): murders, rapes, robberies, assaults, burglaries, thefts, auto thefts, arson, law enforcement employees, police officers, crime map

I mean it sincerely that I'm glad you don't own a gun.

 

[Pat]

Here is something I read the other day about the recent school shooter’s ability to purchase an “assault-STYLE” rifle.

“Our gun laws are structured in the state of Florida in a manner that allows the shooter to buy lethal weapons when that same state considers him too young and immature to buy a beer”.

That seems rather absurd to me...how have we allowed our priorities to become so outdated???

Doug

Doug, do you happen to know what age the government arms young men in the military?

Just so you know, Florida has never made any such assessment as to the maturity of 18 year old drinkers in the state. The National Minimum Drinking Age Act of 1984 required all states to raise their minimum “purchase” and “public possession” of alcohol age to twenty-one. States that did not comply faced a reduction in highway funds under the Federal Highway Aid Act. Florida, like other states did it for the money.
Only seven countries (as of 2014) have drinking ages as high as the United States, which begs the question: Why is ours so high?

 

[Larry L.]

...I mean about YouTube commenters being traceable. I'll have to take your word for it though as I don't think there's much "news" you can trust these days, it all seems fake.

I just mentioned what was reported, Keith. I don't "YouTube", "Twitter", "Facebook" or whatever, so 'darned if I know how valid it is for the EXACT reason you stated.

...So you're basically saying the FBI fell down on the job? (Yes. Unquestionably.) Is that a "thing" in the US? Are they going to follow up on that or just pass the buck?

These days, Keith, I have NO IDEA. There was a time not very long ago when the FBI was trusted implicitly in every way imaginable. But, over the past couple decades or so its 'rep' has gone into the toilet. For ME the last straw was when former FBI Director Comey let Hillary Clinton off the hook with the *$$*&Y#!x MADE UP excuse that the FBI "couldn't prove she had the INTENT" to break the various laws she broke (felonies all) and therefore no recommendation for indictment would be issued. THAT "EXCUSE" WAS AN ABSOLUTE, COMPLETE AND TOTAL F-A-B-R-I-C-A-T-I-O-N created out of thin air. Any of us who've handled classified info/material K-N-O-W we'd be in the CAN right now if we'd done 1/10th of what SHE did. I'm dead serious. We would. No spin - no nuthun. 'Straight skinny.

 

[Rod]

Mocking suicide rates for women??? Who else thinks that's "funny $hit"?

But as I read it Rod, your plan so far, is to wait for five "lost" generations of to die off or are otherwise out of office. Brilliant!!! Then what???
You said there are other things we could do. So please tell us what they are.
What exactly do your "strict measures" look like?
Why haven't they been enacted in the your Democratic Party controlled state or your very liberal but crime ridden city?
What are those laws you'd pass once the NRA fascists are out of the way?
How would those laws be more effective than the laws against murder, assault, rape on the books now?
What's your plan that would prevent future Sandy Hook, Orlando, Las Vegas, and Parkland?
What's your plan to stop future California school shootings such as the ones in the North Park Elementary School in San Bernardino, Rancho Tehama, and the University of California, Santa Barbara? In the latter, the shooter, after promising a "day of retribution" on YouTube, went on a killing spree killing six and wounding thirteen. (sound familiar?)
Speaking of San Bernadino, what's your plan to stop someone like Mr. and Mrs. Farook who on December 2, 2015, killed 14 people and wounded 22 others in a mass shooting and an attempted bombing at the Inland Regional Center.
Why didn't the laws in the "safe" worker's paradise of California stop all that?

As an aside, with your statistical acumen, perhaps you can shed light as to why city-crime.come rates San Francisco crime worse than 92.7% of all U.S. cities.

Crime in San Francisco, California (CA): murders, rapes, robberies, assaults, burglaries, thefts, auto thefts, arson, law enforcement employees, police officers, crime map

I mean it sincerely that I'm glad you don't own a gun.

You’re glad I don’t own a gun? :laugh: I don’t need one nor want one. :thumbsup:

I’m thankful everyday of my life that I don’t live in states like Texas, Florida, Montana, Utah, Arizona, etc. IMO, only the police and military should have them. And I’d be very afraid, if I were one of your neighbors.

Yes, it’s a funny study, because I don’t believe it. Do you believe EVERYTHJNG you read? Just like you guys and gals don’t believe climate science, I don’t believe your study. It’s one study. Generations of women have been taking birth control pills and I haven’t yet seen anyone commit suicide.

San Francisco - I know it well. I lived there. I was just in downtown SF last Wednesday for business. I have family and friends that have lived there their entire lives. I’m up there a lot. I drive and park there. I take BART, Cal Train and Muni (all three transit systems) and have never had any problem since I was a wee little tike. I use to walk into Chinatown to have dinner, where there’s Chinese gangs. And today, where the average price of a home is $1,200,000, the City has been gentrified. BTW, I have no problem taking the subway in NYC either.

I’d stop reading and get outside a little. :laugh:

The NRA’s popular arguments are that gun control only stops law abiding gun owners from owning guns. And gun control doesn’t stop all crime. We need more guns. We need good guys carrying guns to stop bad guys with guns. I’m tired of those arguments. As I said, when this generation of old white men retire, lose their elections or die, laws will change. But unfortunately probably not in our lifetimes.

And please I’m tired of the ALL CRIME has to be stopped. All crime being stopped would be great, but we can make some strides by not allowing a 19 year old to buy an assault weapon, but he can’t buy a beer. Makes total sense. :thumbsdown:

 

[Rod]

Doug, do you happen to know what age the government arms young men in the military?

Only seven countries (as of 2014) have drinking ages as high as the United States, which begs the question: Why is ours so high?

I’d ask, why is their minimum drinking age so low? Maybe the other countries have better transportation systems. Because kids are immature and do stupid things. Just look at the accident statistics for young drivers.

 

[Rod]

Well, in the militrary, they’re trained extremely well.

And maybe we should raise the minimum age of joining the military? Maybe that might help solve some of the PTSD of soldiers returning from battle. Maybe we start them to young? I don’t know the answer, but I still think a 19 year old should not be able buy a gun.

 

[Nick]

A few things you may like to ponder.

Do doctors deliberately go to work with the intention of murdering others?
Do drivers deliberately go for a drive with the intention of murdering others?
Does drinkers drinking result in the murder of others?
In all your mass shootings do the perpetrators go out with their guns with the deliberate intention of murdering others?

If guns don’t kill people people kill people
Who cares if Kim Jong-un gets hold of nukes? Nukes don’t kill people, people kill people.

Why not just ban guns when people are upset about it, just send them thoughts and prayers.
If “thoughts and prayers” are good enough for people who’ve lost their families then its good enough for people who’ve lost their guns.

Perhaps non-American citizens get a distorted view of American thinking on this forum; maybe more Americans get it than we think. Although the response from a gun owner does seem to be an all too common theme from many of your gun owners, “from my cold dead hands” or in this case should that be “your cold dead hands”.


Extra point: Dale Hansen on school shootings - YouTube


Another head hangs lowly
Child is slowly taken
And the violence caused such silence
Who are we mistaking?
But, you see it's not me
It's not my family
In your head, in your head
They are fighting
With their tanks and their bombs
And their bombs and their guns
In your head in your head they are dying
In your head
In your head
Zombie, zombie, zombie

 

[Al Wohlstrom]

Well, in the militrary, they’re trained extremely well.

And maybe we should raise the minimum age of joining the military? Maybe that might help solve some of the PTSD of soldiers returning from battle. Maybe we start them to young? I don’t know the answer, but I still think a 19 year old should not be able buy a gun.

You are severely naive if you think PTSD is age related.

And as for birth control suicide..........
Gun Deaths Increased in 2017, Gun Violence Archive Data Show
Hormonal birth control use linked to increased risk of suicide, study finds | Miami Herald
Medscape: Medscape Access
Hormonal contraception linked to higher risk of suicide, research finds - Hack - triple j
Hormonal contraception linked to higher risk of suicide, research finds - Hack - triple j
http://thefederalist.com/2017/12/04...al-birth-control-triples-womens-risk-suicide/
https://www.romper.com/p/birth-cont...udy-says-but-theres-more-to-the-story-5869790

All those studies were done for nothing, because you have never heard of a suicide, they could of saved time and money by consulting you first.

 

[Al Wohlstrom]

A few things you may like to ponder.

Do doctors deliberately go to work with the intention of murdering others?
Do drivers deliberately go for a drive with the intention of murdering others?
Does drinkers drinking result in the murder of others?
In all your mass shootings do the perpetrators go out with their guns with the deliberate intention of murdering others?

If guns don’t kill people people kill people
Who cares if Kim Jong-un gets hold of nukes? Nukes don’t kill people, people kill people.

Why not just ban guns when people are upset about it, just send them thoughts and prayers.
If “thoughts and prayers” are good enough for people who’ve lost their families then its good enough for people who’ve lost their guns.

Perhaps non-American citizens get a distorted view of American thinking on this forum; maybe more Americans get it than we think. Although the response from a gun owner does seem to be an all too common theme from many of your gun owners, “from my cold dead hands” or in this case should that be “your cold dead hands”.


Extra point: Dale Hansen on school shootings - YouTube


Another head hangs lowly
Child is slowly taken
And the violence caused such silence
Who are we mistaking?
But, you see it's not me
It's not my family
In your head, in your head
They are fighting
With their tanks and their bombs
And their bombs and their guns
In your head in your head they are dying
In your head
In your head
Zombie, zombie, zombie

So 350,000 US deaths really don't matter because there wasn't intent?
They are all preventable, just not as political and with some, not as monetary.

 

[Nick]

So 350,000 US deaths really don't matter because there wasn't intent?
They are all preventable, just not as political and with some, not as monetary.

I never said they did not matter, all lives matter. However, I would say there is a difference between someone who goes out and murders others with intent, and someone who kills others as a result of an accident. It would appear your courts and justice system agrees with me, if they didn't your electric chairs would be far busier.

 

[Doug S.]

I forgot to hit the unsubscribe button last night which put this in my inbox this morning. Unsubscribe now complete. It's very telling when its stated there will be no name calling or bashing but then bash and name call... have fun with the double standards.

Mike, I could be wrong, but I believe that when Randy posted this:

No more bashing each other or name calling. I don’t care what your support status is either.
Back to politics or I will close this thread.

...he was referring to calling other members of the forum names. I did not interpret that to mean that we were not to refer to members of our political parties (like "Trump the Coward", as I call him for his refusal to even acknowledge questions when the answer might reflect negatively on himself) in derogatory terms.

If I'm wrong, I'm sure Randy will let me know somehow.

Cheers!

Doug

 

[Rod]

You are severely naive if you think PTSD is age related.

And as for birth control suicide..........
Gun Deaths Increased in 2017, Gun Violence Archive Data Show
Hormonal birth control use linked to increased risk of suicide, study finds | Miami Herald
Medscape: Medscape Access
Hormonal contraception linked to higher risk of suicide, research finds - Hack - triple j
Hormonal contraception linked to higher risk of suicide, research finds - Hack - triple j
http://thefederalist.com/2017/12/04...al-birth-control-triples-womens-risk-suicide/
https://www.romper.com/p/birth-cont...udy-says-but-theres-more-to-the-story-5869790

All those studies were done for nothing, because you have never heard of a suicide, they could of saved time and money by consulting you first.

A couple things Al.

As far as I can tell, it’s the same study from Denmark that you’re posting over and over. It’s ONE study and, as far as I know, doctors are still prescribing birth control pills to women.

Second, a kids brain isn’t fully formed at the age of 18 and then we send into battle. I have no proof or study to point to, but I said MAYBE, age is a contributing factor to soldiers coming back from battle with PTSD.

So according to the news today, because of his age, the FL killer couldn’t buy a handgun, but was able to buy an assault weapon. :stunned:

 

[Rod]

Out of respect to Randy and the problems he’s dealing with in his life, I’ll refrain for now from calling our president the same name that Rex Tillerson called him, but our ILLEGITIMATE President lies about his lies.

Yesterday, he claims he never said Russia didn’t meddle in the election, but there are a thousand clips of him saying Russia didn’t meddle in the election. He’s called it a hoax, a ruse, etc. Unbelievable.

Resign, impeach, indict, 25th Amendment, take more cheeseburgers to bed. He can be one of those people that have to be lifted by a crane to get themselves out of the house.

 

[Doug S.]

A few things you may like to ponder.

Does drinkers drinking result in the murder of others?
In all your mass shootings do the perpetrators go out with their guns with the deliberate intention of murdering others?

Nick, I think the answer for the first of those two questions is yes...here in the USA we have a criminal offense called "Vehicular Homicide" and if I understand it correctly that is a form of "murder". It is not unusual for drunk drivers to be charged with Vehicular Homicide if their actions result in a wreck that kills someone... :thumbsup:

Sadly, regarding your second question... if I were to speculate (and that's all it can be, since most of the "shooters" end up dead due to the efforts of the law enforcement community to stop their assaults...that should NOT be interpreted as a criticism, BTW), I'd say "Yes". We know that Cruz, who committed 17 murders and inflicted many more injuries, intended to and attempted to kill as many as he could...he's admitted his "premeditated" nature with his online comments to the effect of his desire to be "...a professional school shooter".

This is such a sad event. The gun manufacturers and the NRA must accept at least some of the responsibility in this issue, as they promote the purchase and use of weapons that seem to be primarily military/law enforcement specific in nature, and although there are those who would (and do) profess that they actually hunt deer or other large game with their AR15 assault STYLE rifles, I live in an area that has a huge number of hunters and I only know one who MIGHT use his AR15 for hunting...but he prefers his Ruger deer rifle.

I happen to agree with the developing attitude that AR15 STYLE rifles should be limited to law enforcement and military use. Sure, I know a Ruger deer rifle can be used to target people, too, but when we hear about these mass shootings it always seems to involve the assault STYLE weapons.

What a shame some of our members seem to be so insulted by having their AR15's referred as "assault rifles". It's what they look like, as well as how they can operate (they can be fitted with hardware that turns them into automatic rifles quite easily, I hear). However, they DO seem to have that sensitivity, hence my initiation of using the term "assault STYLE" to avoid insulting their tender feelings about the issue.

My feeling is "why not call a spade a spade" if it's designed for and consistently used for assaults?

Some other peoples' children....I swear! :shocked:

Cheers, Nick!

Doug

 

[Al Wohlstrom]

A couple things Al.

As far as I can tell, it’s the same study from Denmark that you’re posting over and over. It’s ONE study and, as far as I know, doctors are still prescribing birth control pills to women.

Second, a kids brain isn’t fully formed at the age of 18 and then we send into battle. I have no proof or study to point to, but I said MAYBE, age is a contributing factor to soldiers coming back from battle with PTSD.

So according to the news today, because of his age, the FL killer couldn’t buy a handgun, but was able to buy an assault weapon. :stunned:

You are somewhat correct, 3 do quote a Denmark study, 1 is John Hopkins and the other. are from different sources.

I read in a study that the male brain isn't fully formed until around 40 which is about 5 to 10 years after peak performance starts to drop off as in sports, etc. Most good athletes are just starting to excel at 18 or 19. So it wouldn't make good sense to wait another 12 to 15 years.

 

[Al Wohlstrom]

Nick, I think the answer for the first of those two questions is yes...here in the USA we have a criminal offense called "Vehicular Homicide" and if I understand it correctly that is a form of "murder". It is not unusual for drunk drivers to be charged with Vehicular Homicide if their actions result in a wreck that kills someone... :thumbsup:

Sadly, regarding your second question... if I were to speculate (and that's all it can be, since most of the "shooters" end up dead due to the efforts of the law enforcement community to stop their assaults...that should NOT be interpreted as a criticism, BTW), I'd say "Yes". We know that Cruz, who committed 17 murders and inflicted many more injuries, intended to and attempted to kill as many as he could...he's admitted his "premeditated" nature with his online comments to the effect of his desire to be "...a professional school shooter".

This is such a sad event. The gun manufacturers and the NRA must accept at least some of the responsibility in this issue, as they promote the purchase and use of weapons that seem to be primarily military/law enforcement specific in nature, and although there are those who would (and do) profess that they actually hunt deer or other large game with their AR15 assault STYLE rifles, I live in an area that has a huge number of hunters and I only know one who MIGHT use his AR15 for hunting...but he prefers his Ruger deer rifle.

I happen to agree with the developing attitude that AR15 STYLE rifles should be limited to law enforcement and military use. Sure, I know a Ruger deer rifle can be used to target people, too, but when we hear about these mass shootings it always seems to involve the assault STYLE weapons.

What a shame some of our members seem to be so insulted by having their AR15's referred as "assault rifles". It's what they look like, as well as how they can operate (they can be fitted with hardware that turns them into automatic rifles quite easily, I hear). However, they DO seem to have that sensitivity, hence my initiation of using the term "assault STYLE" to avoid insulting their tender feelings about the issue.

My feeling is "why not call a spade a spade" if it's designed for and consistently used for assaults?

Some other peoples' children....I swear! :shocked:

Cheers, Nick!

Doug

This misconception keeps going on, an assault rifle is semi auto, 3 shot burst or full auto with a selector switch. You need a Federal weapons permit to own this type of weapon, they don't just give them out. The AR15 "look" rifles sold to the public are semi auto, the same as your friends Ruger, one shot at a time. How many shooters have been NRA members? None.The shooters all do share one trait, mental illness. There are over 300 million guns in the US. If we stopped gun violence in the most gun controlled areas, L.A., Washington DC, New Orleans, New York, Oakland, Detroit, and others we would be near the bottom of the gun violence list worldwide. We should have extremely harsh penalties for gun sales and gun use in the cities I listed. And if we back out suicides it would be even smaller. If someone wants to end their life, they are going to do it, gun, or not.

 

[Nick]

Nick, I think the answer for the first of those two questions is yes...here in the USA we have a criminal offense called "Vehicular Homicide" and if I understand it correctly that is a form of "murder". It is not unusual for drunk drivers to be charged with Vehicular Homicide if their actions result in a wreck that kills someone... :thumbsup:

Sadly, regarding your second question... if I were to speculate (and that's all it can be, since most of the "shooters" end up dead due to the efforts of the law enforcement community to stop their assaults...that should NOT be interpreted as a criticism, BTW), I'd say "Yes". We know that Cruz, who committed 17 murders and inflicted many more injuries, intended to and attempted to kill as many as he could...he's admitted his "premeditated" nature with his online comments to the effect of his desire to be "...a professional school shooter".

This is such a sad event. The gun manufacturers and the NRA must accept at least some of the responsibility in this issue, as they promote the purchase and use of weapons that seem to be primarily military/law enforcement specific in nature, and although there are those who would (and do) profess that they actually hunt deer or other large game with their AR15 assault STYLE rifles, I live in an area that has a huge number of hunters and I only know one who MIGHT use his AR15 for hunting...but he prefers his Ruger deer rifle.

I happen to agree with the developing attitude that AR15 STYLE rifles should be limited to law enforcement and military use. Sure, I know a Ruger deer rifle can be used to target people, too, but when we hear about these mass shootings it always seems to involve the assault STYLE weapons.

What a shame some of our members seem to be so insulted by having their AR15's referred as "assault rifles". It's what they look like, as well as how they can operate (they can be fitted with hardware that turns them into automatic rifles quite easily, I hear). However, they DO seem to have that sensitivity, hence my initiation of using the term "assault STYLE" to avoid insulting their tender feelings about the issue.

My feeling is "why not call a spade a spade" if it's designed for and consistently used for assaults?

Some other peoples' children....I swear! :shocked:

Cheers, Nick!

Doug

Thanks Doug,

Over here I suspect the drinker would be charged with manslaughter
"the crime of killing a human being without malice aforethought, or in circumstances not amounting to murder"

The gunman murder
The unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another.

We also have corporate manslaughter
an act of homicide committed by a company or organisation.

In my opinion the best case and outcome of corporate manslaughter I have ever seen was unfortunately only in a film, the US based film Runaway Jury, real shame it was not a case of art imitating life.

 

[Pat]

Here's the solution to Doug's issue:

The AR-15 with the "Hello Kitty" Style.
And no, it is not easy to convert a semi auto to full auto and it is a felony.

 

[Al Wohlstrom]

Thanks Doug,

Over here I suspect the drinker would be charged with manslaughter
"the crime of killing a human being without malice aforethought, or in circumstances not amounting to murder"

The gunman murder
The unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another.

We also have corporate manslaughter
an act of homicide committed by a company or organisation.

In my opinion the best case and outcome of corporate manslaughter I have ever seen was unfortunately only in a film, the US based film Runaway Jury, real shame it was not a case of art imitating life.

A person that kills when inebriated makes a conscious decision to drink when they know they shouldn't and drive when they know they shouldn't , that is intent, or total disregard for a chance of known outcome. And as Veek said the full auto convert is not easy, and a felony.

 

[Doug S.]

This misconception keeps going on, an assault rifle is semi auto, 3 shot burst or full auto with a selector switch. You need a Federal weapons permit to own this type of weapon, they don't just give them out. The AR15 "look" rifles sold to the public are semi auto, the same as your friends Ruger, one shot at a time.

Al, the availability of "retrofit kits" to turn AR15 assault "STYLE" rifles into automatic rifles has been well documented for a long time. This Cruz kid may not have used one of them, but the shooter in Vegas most assuredly used a "bump stock"...another manner of modifying an AR15 to make it function like a fully automatic. Those "kits" should be illegal, IMHO. Who uses an automatic rifle for hunting? Nobody I know, and I know a LOT of hunters in this area...it has one of the highest wildlife counts in the state of KS.

I've mentioned this before, but I'll relate the experience again:

I was walking into a Kroger grocery store in Huntsville, TX and there was a family...a father with three kids, all under school age...sitting at a table at the entrance selling raffle tickets. I stopped and asked what they were raffling off and one of the younger children said what I thought was "An R-V". I thought perhaps I might risk a few dollars to see if I could win the raffle, so I asked what kind of RV it was...I was immediately corrected by one of the older children, who informed me that they were raffling off an AR15, not an RV.

The thought that they could do that legally, much less right in front of the entrance to a grocery store (which must certainly have had to grant permission for that), just flabergasted me...and scared the hell out of me. My answer was "No thanks, I don't play with guns."

I'd bet a paycheck that young child (too young to go to school) had fired that AR15. We are training our kids to adopt lethal weapons from a young age. No wonder Cruz's choice was to buy an assault "STYLE" rifle :idea:

Our gun laws must change if we're going to stem the slaughter of our children, or even our adults as they recreate in dance halls or attend outdoor concerts. Nothing we've done so far has been effective, so why not give it a try? We require a person to be a certain age before they can purchase alcohol (yeah, I know about the FL age to buy guns vs. alcohol...they probably are starting to get the idea now that the law needs to be changed and not to reduce the age for buying alcohol), drive a car, operate farm machinery (KS does require anyone under 14 to take a safety course, though, before they can operate a tractor), so there is precedent and IMHO that precedent would certainly be adequate to rebut the claims of those who feel the 2nd amendment entitles ANYONE of ANY AGE (really???) to own and use a firearm (Yes, Larry, I know what the 2nd amendment says...no need to remind me, it won't change my opinion). In TX anyone wanting to get a concealed gun carry license must pass an education course, what would have been wrong with that in FL? The gun education courses are most often taught at the sporting goods stores, where the weapons are sold...and where questionable individuals wanting to purchase a weapon can be identified and required to submit to further "evaluation" regarding the advisability of selling them a lethal weapon.

We can't do that if our POTUS will not even acknowledge that he has been asked a question about gun control ("Thank you very much, thank you very much" is not an acknowledgement, IMHO). We must get rid of him, or every person who supports him should be ashamed of themselves the next time a shooter kills kids in a school. Sure, Trump the Coward may be a very good businessman, but in the opinion of the majority of the voting age population in our country he's a terrible president. He's gotta go, plain and simple.

Doug