"Vigilante 6.0 Vengeance" project

Jackal

CURRENTLY BANNED
There it is... Seems not so easy.
Thx mate. Looks possible to make but it also means windows must be all the way up or all the way down when driving. Very interesting though. I most probably would not go that way. My side windows are way bigger than on his car. Might just bring the tunnels out a bit.
 
Hey Jackal looks like we're both still at it after all these years LOL Still shaving that foam! I'm nearing getting the rear of mine to the mold stage finally. But I let mine set for about 2 years with no work. So getting back on it is full of energy & anticipation. Keep on keepin on.
 

Jackal

CURRENTLY BANNED
Hey Jackal looks like we're both still at it after all these years LOL Still shaving that foam! I'm nearing getting the rear of mine to the mold stage finally. But I let mine set for about 2 years with no work. So getting back on it is full of energy & anticipation. Keep on keepin on.
Hi Mike. Yeah mate. Also still at it! Chassis and other stuff coming along. Check pics.
 

Jackal

CURRENTLY BANNED
Some progress pics
 

Attachments

Jackal

CURRENTLY BANNED
Lookin tip top Mate
Thanks mate. Still have to figure out the gear mechanism. Will be Cable but not quite sure how to do it yet. Looking for radiators and intercooler as well at the moment, once everything is fitted........ then strip down completely for powder coating etc.
 
Hi jackal

Unless there are still some links missing those rear suspension arms makes no sense to me at all, no triangulation at the bottom, and what restrains the top of the rear upright in the fore and aft plane?

Cheers

Fred W B
 

Terry Oxandale

Skinny Man
Supporter
I was about to ask the same thing when I couldn't find a trailing arm on top, but if his lower control arm was sufficiently rigid (would not twist), one could dispense with the trailing arm on top.
 
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No, not gonna work, first time the brakes are applied its going to tie itself in knots, lock a rear wheel to upright and push back n forth, it will become obvious.
 

Terry Oxandale

Skinny Man
Supporter
Does this mean then that you will double shock the rears with parallel shocks? If this is correct, I am concerned this is still insufficient (not addressing the root concerns posted) in preventing a major failure of the rear suspension components with any power or traction. You've got an awesome project going on, and we want to see it come to a safe conclusion is all.
 

Jackal

CURRENTLY BANNED
Does this mean then that you will double shock the rears with parallel shocks? If this is correct, I am concerned this is still insufficient (not addressing the root concerns posted) in preventing a major failure of the rear suspension components with any power or traction. You've got an awesome project going on, and we want to see it come to a safe conclusion is all.
Hi Terry.

I appreciate all comments. It is.my first major project. The rear single shocks is not in the centre as can be seen on the pics. There will be a second shock on the other side. There is also torsion bars that has to be installed. I see what you guys are saying and will chat to my mate who is doing it for me.

Cheers mate.
 

Terry Oxandale

Skinny Man
Supporter
Glad to hear! I really want to watch this through its completion. As you've probably observed on other suspensions similar to this, the shock doesn't need to be in the "center" to be effective, but the shock cannot be a link used to control motion of the suspension in any axis other than the longitudinal axis of the shock itself. This is where the suspension arms/links must be designed to control motion in all three axis, which then leaves the shock to only dampen that movement, and the spring to position it (and support the weight). When you talk to your mate about this, also query him about the lower arm's lack of triangulation. The current photo, even if welded with gussets, leaves a large risk of folding up (aside from the twisting motion already noted by Jac). The uprights appear to look sturdy enough with the large gauge sheet you're using, but the arms/links will need a serious re-evaluation (in my humble opinion).

One last thing while I'm spewing out advice about your business, now that I stuck my nose in it:
You've got steel uprights in the rear, which are of heavy gauge steel. You've got an excellent opportunity to weld the shock mounting brackets directly to the upright instead of using the ones on the lower control arm. Mounting the shock directly onto the upright does a number of beneficial things, but the most important is that it takes the corner weight off the the Heim joints (which should ideally be only used to control suspension movement). Doing this would increase the reliability (read safety) of the car tremendously by practically eliminating any shear loading on the Heim joints themselves.

Please take some time to review/study basic suspension design and forces, and utilize the many many photos on this site to validate your designs. 99% of what has been shown by builders on this site are well-vetted designs that should endure without failure for the lifetime of the car. I would also be cautious on what comes out of someone else's fabrication. If this person is not demonstrating (via the build result) a competent understanding of structural design, and the forces experienced in a chassis, then you may need to question/address that as well.

Good luck going forward.
 
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Jackal

CURRENTLY BANNED
Glad to hear! I really want to watch this through its completion. As you've probably observed on other suspensions similar to this, the shock doesn't need to be in the "center" to be effective, but the shock cannot be a link used to control motion of the suspension in any axis other than the longitudinal axis of the shock itself. This is where the suspension arms/links must be designed to control motion in all three axis, which then leaves the shock to only dampen that movement, and the spring to position it (and support the weight). When you talk to your mate about this, also query him about the lower arm's lack of triangulation. The current photo, even if welded with gussets, leaves a large risk of folding up (aside from the twisting motion already noted by Jac). The uprights appear to look sturdy enough with the large gauge sheet you're using, but the arms/links will need a serious re-evaluation (in my humble opinion).

One last thing while I'm spewing out advice about your business, now that I stuck my nose in it:
You've got steel uprights in the rear, which are of heavy gauge steel. You've got an excellent opportunity to weld the shock mounting brackets directly to the upright instead of using the ones on the lower control arm. Mounting the shock directly onto the upright does a number of beneficial things, but the most important is that it takes the corner weight off the the Heim joints (which should ideally be only used to control suspension movement). Doing this would increase the reliability (read safety) of the car tremendously by practically eliminating any shear loading on the Heim joints themselves.

Please take some time to review/study basic suspension design and forces, and utilize the many many photos on this site to validate your designs. 99% of what has been shown by builders on this site are well-vetted designs that should endure without failure for the lifetime of the car. I would also be cautious on what comes out of someone else's fabrication. If this person is not demonstrating (via the build result) a competent understanding of structural design, and the forces experienced in a chassis, then you may need to question/address that as well.

Good luck going forward.
Hi Terry thanks for the input. Went to mate today. (1,5 hr drive). Took some aluminium pipe and the radiators to him.asked him about the concerns raised. He showed me brackets and bars erc. That still have to be installed. Will post pics when everything is done. Will also show him your suggestions. Everything must be stripped again for welding up of the chassis, suspension etc. Then off to powdercoating. Motor and box just fitted for engine brackets.

He has also started with the intake manifold. Will post pic from pc tomorrow.
 
Hi Jackal

Glad to hear you are taking advice.

Does your mate know anything about the design of suspension geometry? If the upper inner A arm mounts (on the chassis) are at the same height or higher than the upper outer mounts (on the upright) which is what it looks like in this picture the car will handle dangerously. If he can't tell you what swing axle length he has designed with you have some research / reading to do.

Regards

Fred W B


 

Terry Oxandale

Skinny Man
Supporter
I had considered this as well, but it appears at the worst, the arms are truly parallel, and with the top one shorter than the bottom, it may not be ideal, but at least it won't be positive camber gain when it should be negative.
 
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