F1 in 2012
- Thread starter Pete
- Start date
Now some people will get their way:
Life after Bernie????
F1 run by a committee of team owners, really ?????
Formula One chief Bernie Ecclestone prepares $10 billion flotation - Telegraph
:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:
Life after Bernie????
F1 run by a committee of team owners, really ?????
Formula One chief Bernie Ecclestone prepares $10 billion flotation - Telegraph
:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:
Malcolm, that's right, I recall now that Bernie brought in some private equity folks not so far back for a partial buy out. The reason to do so is usually to create liquidity for the prior owners, or in this case, owner (BE). That transaction doesn't really change anything in terms of the dynamic though - private equity folks take the same approach as BE, it's a business first and foremost. That which makes more money is what will be done, and it has nothing to do with what's good for the sport. Again, the current situation sucks, there's a better pathway here where management and direction of F1 is controlled not just by profit maximization.
Incidentally, F1 is a lot safer now due to pressure from manufacturers and drivers, not anything BE did. Jackie Stewart is a notable champion of racing safety and did a lot of highly effective campaigning to improve things over the years.
Reading between the lines of all this, I am thinking that Ferrari and Red Bull's decision to quit FOTA because they "do not agree with the Resource Agreement" is linked to a potential breakaway. One thing is for sure, Bernie might be a Mad Midget but he is infinitely preferable to a shady gang made up of Black Horses with wings...
David Morton
Lifetime Supporter
Rumour is the Midget sold out to pay the settlement costs for the dee-vorce on his incredibly tall osteuropean previous wife.
The other rumour is he is trying to buy it all back again. Not her. F1.
Bernie Ecclestone, daughter Petra and his ex wife Slavica.
I think that Big Ron might be in there somewhere as well but he is also still making big payments on the mortgage for the rather ostentatious Dennisland in Woking.
Rumours abound about who owns what in CVC and do JPM- Chase want any involvement ?
The other rumour is he is trying to buy it all back again. Not her. F1.
I think that Big Ron might be in there somewhere as well but he is also still making big payments on the mortgage for the rather ostentatious Dennisland in Woking.
Rumours abound about who owns what in CVC and do JPM- Chase want any involvement ?
Personally I have never believed that Dietrich Mateschitz owns 2 x F1 racing teams because he likes motor racing. I think he is after much bigger fish, but Horner should really be careful what enemies he makes on the way up - as he is mostly likely to need them when Dietrich cuts the elastic.
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
Ferrari announced that Felipe Massa will be driving chassis number 294 in Sepang, as opposed to 293 that he used in Melbourne. This, by itself, is not major news. Teams do tend to go through a couple of chassis throughout the year. What's interesting however is the wording that Ferrari used to justify this decision. They said: "This choice was taken to clear up any doubts about the unusual performance of his car during the weekend at Albert Park".
This statement struck me, because there have been no suggestions whatsoever anywhere in the press (printed or online) that Massa's Australian predicament was down to a defect chassis, there was therefore no need for Ferrari to go public with that. Ferrari's decision to use the words "clear up any doubts" implies that, to them, it's not an issue and that this has been an internal confrontation, apparently between Massa's side and Ferrari management. Ferrari, though, go a step further and state that: "Felipe knows he can count on the team to do everything, both from the technical and the operational point of view, to put him in a better state to show off his talents – even at the cost of extra work in these few days that separate the Australian race from the one in Malaysia".
To me, this reads like a disclaimer a lawyer would have written, and definitely not a simple team announcement. I read it like a direct message to Massa: we give you everything, we even respond to unreasonable demands at the cost of extra work, so it's up to you to deliver. I am not used to Ferrari conducting (thinly veiled) dialogue with their drivers in public, so I am very concerned that the above statement is a prelude to the oncoming Massa's replacement. It appears Ferrari have had enough, and are willing to go public just to make sure everybody understands it's not the car's fault, but Massa's. If the situation inside the team was harmonious, then I would have expected a very simple and to-the-point statement, such as "Felipe Massa will be driving chassis No294 in Sepang", and nothing more. The way the statement is written can be useful when terminating a contract, because it puts on records that: (a) the team have gone over and beyond their normal procedures to assist Massa, (b) they have done so at an extra cost in terms of manhours and shipping and (c) Felipe is aware of that.
All this additional seasoning makes me suspicious.
This statement struck me, because there have been no suggestions whatsoever anywhere in the press (printed or online) that Massa's Australian predicament was down to a defect chassis, there was therefore no need for Ferrari to go public with that. Ferrari's decision to use the words "clear up any doubts" implies that, to them, it's not an issue and that this has been an internal confrontation, apparently between Massa's side and Ferrari management. Ferrari, though, go a step further and state that: "Felipe knows he can count on the team to do everything, both from the technical and the operational point of view, to put him in a better state to show off his talents – even at the cost of extra work in these few days that separate the Australian race from the one in Malaysia".
To me, this reads like a disclaimer a lawyer would have written, and definitely not a simple team announcement. I read it like a direct message to Massa: we give you everything, we even respond to unreasonable demands at the cost of extra work, so it's up to you to deliver. I am not used to Ferrari conducting (thinly veiled) dialogue with their drivers in public, so I am very concerned that the above statement is a prelude to the oncoming Massa's replacement. It appears Ferrari have had enough, and are willing to go public just to make sure everybody understands it's not the car's fault, but Massa's. If the situation inside the team was harmonious, then I would have expected a very simple and to-the-point statement, such as "Felipe Massa will be driving chassis No294 in Sepang", and nothing more. The way the statement is written can be useful when terminating a contract, because it puts on records that: (a) the team have gone over and beyond their normal procedures to assist Massa, (b) they have done so at an extra cost in terms of manhours and shipping and (c) Felipe is aware of that.
All this additional seasoning makes me suspicious.
It's a shame that possibly the best driver in F1 today (FA)has a nasty habit of destroying (or attempting to destroy) team mates. Didn't work with Hamilton though. On his day, Massa was amongst the fastest - he must be totally demoralised what with a Brawn shock absorber spring up his nose as well.
Prost did exact same thing at Ferrari - destabilised Mansell but got himself fired in the end.
Enzo's spirit is seemingly still alive and well at the prancing donkey!
I would really like Massa to perform well if only to shove it up them - but what's the chance of that now?
Prost did exact same thing at Ferrari - destabilised Mansell but got himself fired in the end.
Enzo's spirit is seemingly still alive and well at the prancing donkey!
I would really like Massa to perform well if only to shove it up them - but what's the chance of that now?
Jim Craik
Lifetime Supporter
Nice guys rarely become World Champion. In the modern era I can only think of a few.
Mika, Jenson, Damon..........
I may have missed one or two, but you get the idea.
World Champions tend to be much more like:
Prost
Senna
Mansell
Jones
Schumacher
Piquet
Alonso
Welcome to the Piranha Club.
Mika, Jenson, Damon..........
I may have missed one or two, but you get the idea.
World Champions tend to be much more like:
Prost
Senna
Mansell
Jones
Schumacher
Piquet
Alonso
Welcome to the Piranha Club.
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That's a bit harsh - nothing wrong with Mansell or Alan Jones - just ordinary Joes really, actually, exceptionally ordinary, but don't get me started on Prost or Piquet in particular.
So, what indiscretions have Nigel and Alan committed to be allowed to swim in the shark tank?
Overweight?
So, what indiscretions have Nigel and Alan committed to be allowed to swim in the shark tank?
Overweight?
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
Yes I agree Keith it would be really good to see Massa Stick it up them.
F.A. apparently has a charming manner with the crew and gets them on side (his) very easily. Seems he has Massa well and truly in the doldrums after one race.
F.A. apparently has a charming manner with the crew and gets them on side (his) very easily. Seems he has Massa well and truly in the doldrums after one race.
Jim Craik
Lifetime Supporter
We are all allowed our own opinions.
Here is one from someone who should know.
"I think Alan (Jones) is just a grossly inconsiderate person, quite honestly" quote by Patrick Head.
As far as Mansell goes, I have always seen him as a "piss moaning, cry baby".
A recent poll shows Mansell to be one of the 50 biggest jerks in all of sports.
Here is one from someone who should know.
"I think Alan (Jones) is just a grossly inconsiderate person, quite honestly" quote by Patrick Head.
As far as Mansell goes, I have always seen him as a "piss moaning, cry baby".
A recent poll shows Mansell to be one of the 50 biggest jerks in all of sports.
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Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
I have had the pleasure of meeting Alan Jones on several occasions, and on one notable occasion we were the last to leave the restaurant after very long long
lunch, much the worse for wear. I have always found him charming and a good bloke. I must add this was some time after he had retired from F1, how he was then I have no idea.
lunch, much the worse for wear. I have always found him charming and a good bloke. I must add this was some time after he had retired from F1, how he was then I have no idea.
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
Right on Malcolm, they are all Gods compared to us mere mortals.
My company used to sponsor a Formula 5000 team in a car built by John McDonald of RAM racing fame. Alan Jones was the driver and many was the time I had to double up the use of the company station wagon to ferry slicks around for the team. He was a gritty no-nonsense typical Oz but got the job done and was a good man to have a beer with.
Mansell has always had bad press - most of it British. He typifies the characteristic "British Bulldog" character, punching well above his weight and is not blessed with the "charisma" that say, James Hunt had (now he COULD be a pissant). With a broken neck and a broken back Mansell overcame all obstacles to become world champion largely funded by himself. Plus he still holds a record that won't be broken anytime soon (F1/CART champion in the same year). Personally, I forgive him some of his apparent lack of 'media skills' and remember, the great Colin Chapman saw this potential way ahead of anyone else.
Finally, I hardly think an engineer (Head) makes a good judge of character as they traditionally hate people that use their stuff and have themselves all the charisma of a World War I Stokes Trench Mortar shell.
An opinion of yours maybe, but based on what others have written.
I would like to see this "recent poll" you refer to - can you send a link?
I think your abuse of these major achievers is quite uncalled for. Your argument is puerile and your opinion is based on other peoples opinion who have agendas making your opinion as valid as Sarkozy.
No-one but no-one reaches the highest pinnacle in any sport by being a 'nice guy' at least in public and I believe you to be a gullible victim of media assasination sir and I fart in your general direction.
Keith Hardy - Fat Formula One Racing Driver Defence League 2012
OK bus is coming now - must go.
Jim Craik
Lifetime Supporter
Posted by Keith.
Keith, in a discussion about how Massa has fared in F1, I commented that with few exceptions "Nice guys rarely become Word Champion"
I then listed a few exceptions:
Mika, Jenson and Damon.
I then listed a group:
World Champions tend to be much more like:
Prost
Senna
Mansell
Jones
Schumacher
Piquet
Alonso
<!-- google_ad_section_end -->Keith, so lumping Mansell and Jones in with the likes of: Senna, Prost, Shumacher, Piquet and Alonzo to you constitutes "ABUSE".
Keith,
I think that most drivers in the modern era would love to be "Abused" that way.
All those men are multiple World Champions (except Mansell and Jones).
You said that "was a bit harsh" and then added:
"So, what indiscretions have Nigel and Alan committed to be allowed to swim in the shark tank?"
So at your request I added a couple of examples. So now my answers to your request costitutes "abuse".
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Jim Craik
Lifetime Supporter
Keith, you asked for a "link"
<LI class=g>Nigel Mansell - Biggest Jerks in Sports - UnSpun.com <CITE>unspun.com › Sports › Other-General Sports</CITE>Cached
You +1'd this publicly. Undo
Nigel Mansell. Rank 50 on: Biggest Jerks in Sports. Categories: Sports, Other-<WBR>General Sports. Added by: anonymous on 02/12/2007 | Flag this. You must be ...
Keith, do you think that the likes of Mika, Damon or Jenson would ever be on a list like that?
***********
Keith, you do not believe Patric Head, talking of his driver, will you believe Mr Jones himself?
<LI class=g>
<LI class=g>In a recent interview Alan Jones was told:
"Many people have said, you were a belligerent and hard-nosed bugger to deal with"
<LI class=g>Jones then said: Well, yes you are right, I was! I look back on those days with some embarrassment now!
Keith, does that sound like something Jenson, Damon or Mika would have to say?
*******************
I remember watching Nigel Mansell racing in 1992. He won the first five races, ended with nine wins and ******14 POLES*******
Yet he complained constantly about the car, ****I mean non-stop crtitsizem of the car and the team****, to the point that he quit Williams and walked away from F1 at the end of the season.
Keith, do these sound like the kind of thing that Jenson, Damon, Mika, Massa, Coultard or Barracello would do or say?
Keith do you think that Jenson, Damon, Mika, Massa, Coultard or Barracello would ever be voted on a list of sports biggest jerks?
<LI class=g>Nigel Mansell - Biggest Jerks in Sports - UnSpun.com <CITE>unspun.com › Sports › Other-General Sports</CITE>Cached
You +1'd this publicly. Undo
Nigel Mansell. Rank 50 on: Biggest Jerks in Sports. Categories: Sports, Other-<WBR>General Sports. Added by: anonymous on 02/12/2007 | Flag this. You must be ...
Keith, do you think that the likes of Mika, Damon or Jenson would ever be on a list like that?
***********
Keith, you do not believe Patric Head, talking of his driver, will you believe Mr Jones himself?
<LI class=g>
<LI class=g>In a recent interview Alan Jones was told:
"Many people have said, you were a belligerent and hard-nosed bugger to deal with"
<LI class=g>Jones then said: Well, yes you are right, I was! I look back on those days with some embarrassment now!
Keith, does that sound like something Jenson, Damon or Mika would have to say?
*******************
I remember watching Nigel Mansell racing in 1992. He won the first five races, ended with nine wins and ******14 POLES*******
Yet he complained constantly about the car, ****I mean non-stop crtitsizem of the car and the team****, to the point that he quit Williams and walked away from F1 at the end of the season.
Keith, do these sound like the kind of thing that Jenson, Damon, Mika, Massa, Coultard or Barracello would do or say?
Keith do you think that Jenson, Damon, Mika, Massa, Coultard or Barracello would ever be voted on a list of sports biggest jerks?
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Ha!
All I have learned from your diatribe is that there is a dubious website called "Unspun" and that my name appears to be "Keith"
My God - I hope your spleen is OK following that venting.
You win.
I cannot do this.
"Mansell was (is) a whining arsehole and Jones had a hard nose."
(Ref: Craiks F1 Law 2012)
In defence of (successful) Fat Drivers Everywhere
All I have learned from your diatribe is that there is a dubious website called "Unspun" and that my name appears to be "Keith"
My God - I hope your spleen is OK following that venting.
You win.
I cannot do this.
"Mansell was (is) a whining arsehole and Jones had a hard nose."
(Ref: Craiks F1 Law 2012)
In defence of (successful) Fat Drivers Everywhere
